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Post by nick on Apr 3, 2008 16:56:06 GMT 1
Really my question is has it been a success in all the cities? And what routes would you like to become a overground/which overground routes need be de-overground.
Personally the 28/92/95 needs to be become a overground and they all need to layover. I think that the 28 should start from clarence dock and go via infirmary street as it was chucked out of the bus station. Then the 95/28 could swtich over at clarence dock. 95 runs every twenty minutes between Boddington Hall and Clarence dock running alongside the 28 which would mean that headingley-clarence dock bit of the journey would recieve a frequnecy off every 10 minutes
X6 needs to become a overground colour(Purple Line). 622/623/626 could do with becoming a overground colour because of the 10 minute frequency between Worse and Shipley and also let the argument of the 99 becoming a overground service continue(removing it from the other thread)!
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revol
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Post by revol on Apr 3, 2008 17:22:17 GMT 1
I still think the 5 and 99 should be overground. North East Leeds is the only district without an overground route running to a satellite town in the area.
I agree with the X6 being made into an Overground route. They should also actually apply some livery to the buses too!
I think the 18, 33, 56 and 96 should all use Geminis as the main type of buses. All the overground routes in Leeds should also have branding applied to them.
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Post by nick on Apr 3, 2008 17:31:24 GMT 1
The 5 does need to be made into a overground i will admit but i have to say with competion from the 42(Old Farnley) it is probley going to stay as it is.
Here is what i said about the 99 in other thread: Yes but you have to remember that alongside the X98 the wetherby foke get a every half our service. First/Metro wouldnt implant this as there is competion taken from the 770 service and metro wouldnt want two very important routes going against each other. And anyway they are more or less every 15 minutes(770,98,X98)
The most the X98 and 99 services could get upragded to is every 20 minutes as First(Cherry Row) dont have the capcity to do every 10 mins as a said in a prevous reply!
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revol
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Post by revol on Apr 3, 2008 17:36:36 GMT 1
I'm aware that the 98 runs a very similar route to the 99. But so does the 55 with the 51, and the 757 with the 33.
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Post by westyorkshirebus on Apr 3, 2008 17:46:41 GMT 1
Overground routes in Leeds and Bradford need to run every 10-12 minutes and any variation where 2 service numbers are used along the route needs to be quite small
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Post by Craig on Apr 3, 2008 18:23:12 GMT 1
I have just posted on the other thread before finding this one.
The only route I can think of which should lose its Overground status is Huddersfield's 327.
The 28/92/95 can't really be overground as 2 out of the 3 routes only run during term time. Not to mention they follow very different routes!
The 5 could, at best, be increased to every 15 minutes but even this could be difficult to justify.
And the 99 should not be every 10 minutes - end of!
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Post by nick on Apr 3, 2008 18:27:03 GMT 1
West Yorkshire Bus hesne why the 96/96A varient was cut down to the 96 running from Holt Park. This is why the 99/X98 dosnt need a overground to it. What it needs first is a nice retimed timetable maybe the 99 every 40 minutes with the X98 every hour creating the every 20 frequency between Leeds and whetherby and if H&D can be bothered retiming the 770 alongside metro this would mean a every 10 minute service which you are looking for (between the two bus firms)
Also before that happens the 99/X98 route needs to have a improvment in the fleet. The perfect solution is to send three or four of the dual doors from Kirstall to Cherry Row and see how they perform on a rural routing(they do fine on the X84).
I think that the X84 could do with a branding as it is First leeds top route (36 is H&D,508 is Halifax,X6 is Bradford's,363 is Huddersfileds).
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Post by Craig on Apr 3, 2008 18:36:07 GMT 1
But isn't most traffic between the centres of Leeds and Wetherby. The 99 serves the intermediate villages hourly, probably on a tender, because that is fine for a rural village. The X98 should be increased in frequency because it provides a fast link between 2 important areas and also serves the whole northern area of Wetherby too. First have also got a great advantage here which they should exploit - there is no rail link to compete with, so the only options to commuter are bus or car.
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Post by leedstom on Apr 3, 2008 18:50:15 GMT 1
I think that the X84 could do with a branding as it is First leeds top route (36 is H&D,508 is Halifax,X6 is Bradford's,363 is Huddersfileds). Without being rude, How do you know that the X84 is First Leeds's best route? Personally I would have thought it would have been something like the 49 or 50 cos they always seem pretty full.
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Post by jackh on Apr 3, 2008 18:58:38 GMT 1
Exactly what is so great about this route please Nick, explain your self when making such statements. From posts you have made, it appears you live in Otley area hence why you seem to "big" up the X84, 33/33A etc.
In all fairness, the X84 really gets fare paying passengers from Otley as it's the quickest route into Leeds and like Wetherby there is no competing rail service. Beyond that it's free pass country as Burley/Ilkley/Skipton are served by frequent, modern, comfortable electric train services which would be hard for First to compete with so that will be the preferable public transport choice rather than the bus.
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revol
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Post by revol on Apr 3, 2008 19:24:48 GMT 1
As I mentioned earlier, I think all overground routes should be branded, and look something like this:
16: Seacroft - Coldcotes Circus - City Centre - Bramley Shopping Centre - Pudsey 18: One side: Garforth - York Road - City Centre - Kirkstall Lane - Tinshill, other side: Colton - York Road - City Centre - Kirkstall Lane - Ireland Wood 37: Halton Moor - York Road - Leeds 40/50 (For the Geminis): One side: City Centre - Cross Gates - Seacroft, other side: Seacroft - City Centre - Horsforth 42: Old Farnley - Copley Hill - City Centre - St. James' Hospital - Fearnville 51: Moor Allerton - Meanwood - City Centre - Elland Road - Morley Town Hall 71: Primley Park - Scott Hall - Leeds 96: Holt Park - Cookridge - Universities - Leeds
With the "Every 10 minutes" branding on the side.
And I really do think all Overground services (Besides the 1 and the 4) should use Geminis. Looking at Bradford and Halifax, their overground buses look so much smarter than ours, with new cleaner buses and branding.
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kendall17
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Justice for the 96!
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Post by kendall17 on Apr 3, 2008 19:40:17 GMT 1
As I mentioned earlier, I think all overground routes should be branded, and look something like this: 16: Seacroft - St. James' Hospital - Leeds - Bramley Centre - Pudsey18: One side: Garforth - Leeds - Tinshill, other side: Colton - Leeds - Ireland Wood37: Halton Moor - York Road - Leeds40/50 (For the Geminis): Leeds - Cross Gates - Seacroft Shopping Centre - St James' Hospital - Leeds - Burley Road - Horsforth42: Old Farnley - Leeds - St. James' Hospital - Fearnville51: Moor Allerton Shopping Centre - Meanwood - Leeds - Elland Road - Morley Town Hall71: Primley Park - Scott Hall - Leeds96: Holt Park - Cookridge - Universities - LeedsWith the "Every 10 minutes" branding on the side. And I really do think all Overground services (Besides the 1 and the 4) should use Geminis. Looking at Bradford and Halifax, their overground buses look so much smarter than ours, with new cleaner buses and branding. no 56 then? any reason?
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revol
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Post by revol on Apr 3, 2008 19:46:03 GMT 1
As I mentioned earlier, I think all overground routes should be branded, and look something like this: 16: Seacroft - St. James' Hospital - Leeds - Bramley Centre - Pudsey18: One side: Garforth - Leeds - Tinshill, other side: Colton - Leeds - Ireland Wood37: Halton Moor - York Road - Leeds40/50 (For the Geminis): Leeds - Cross Gates - Seacroft Shopping Centre - St James' Hospital - Leeds - Burley Road - Horsforth42: Old Farnley - Leeds - St. James' Hospital - Fearnville51: Moor Allerton Shopping Centre - Meanwood - Leeds - Elland Road - Morley Town Hall71: Primley Park - Scott Hall - Leeds96: Holt Park - Cookridge - Universities - LeedsWith the "Every 10 minutes" branding on the side. And I really do think all Overground services (Besides the 1 and the 4) should use Geminis. Looking at Bradford and Halifax, their overground buses look so much smarter than ours, with new cleaner buses and branding. no 56 then? any reason? The 56 already has branding on it's ALX400s, as does the 33 on it's Royales. And the 1 on it's Fusions, the 4 on the Streetcars and 2/3/12/13/49 on their Geminis. I feel they should use the branding on the 33s and 56s for, if they ever fully use them, their Geminis.
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Post by nick on Apr 3, 2008 20:31:05 GMT 1
Exactly what is so great about this route please Nick, explain your self when making such statements. it appears you live in Otley area Sorry i was meant to say that it is First best long route not short route. I admit it does have competion from the rail travel but you have to remeber that since the introudction Free OAP pass it will be even more full(AS Skipton is out of metro's train plan and OAP have to pay for the Skipton-First Metro station and the X84 is a local bus). And since it is the quickest way to get from Otley,Bramhope,Adel to leeds it makes money between the Otley-Leeds part. This is why a upgrade was needed and the Otley-Skipton part is payed for by passengers who are on the Leeds-Otley part with some continuing Quite wrong i live no where near otley but if you carry along the A65 south into the sub-urban area you shall find me!!
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revol
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Post by revol on Apr 3, 2008 20:37:41 GMT 1
Thought I'd edit my branding ideas to relate more to the locations on the timetable maps.
I think the 40/50 buses should have similar branding to the new 2/3/12/13 branding. Stickers saying "THE ORANGE LINE" and "THE INDIGO LINE" each side of the top deck's window and orange and indigo stripes on the bottom.
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Post by nick on Apr 3, 2008 20:40:23 GMT 1
Would be a good idea as they do swap over at the Bus Station(Seacroft). The only thing though they dont need that as sometime a bus leaving Horsforth sometimes has the destination Secroft Bus Station and Cross Gates!!
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Post by jackh on Apr 3, 2008 20:48:39 GMT 1
Exactly what is so great about this route please Nick, explain your self when making such statements. it appears you live in Otley area Sorry i was meant to say that it is First best long route not short route. I admit it does have competion from the rail travel but you have to remeber that since the introudction Free OAP pass it will be even more full(AS Skipton is out of metro's train plan and OAP have to pay for the Skipton-First Metro station and the X84 is a local bus). And since it is the quickest way to get from Otley,Bramhope,Adel to leeds it makes money between the Otley-Leeds part. This is why a upgrade was needed and the Otley-Skipton part is payed for by passengers who are on the Leeds-Otley part with some continuing The previous free travel scheme enabled twirlies to do the full route of the X84 to Skipton.
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Post by nick on Apr 3, 2008 20:54:45 GMT 1
A question: What changes are happening to the Overground services in west yorkshire this april change!!
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Post by leedstom on Apr 3, 2008 21:01:30 GMT 1
A question: What changes are happening to the Overground services in west yorkshire this april change!! From reading another thread (that I know you've been on) all that is happening to Overground routes is: Services 18/18A/40/49/50/50A are having Amended Timetables.
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revol
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Post by revol on Apr 3, 2008 21:13:58 GMT 1
Would be a good idea as they do swap over at the Bus Station(Seacroft). The only thing though they dont need that as sometime a bus leaving Horsforth sometimes has the destination Secroft Bus Station and Cross Gates!! I think that's for people who are going to Crossgates and getting on the 50 so it can become the 40 at Seacroft. Kind of like how the 12's destination blind reads "Moortown Circular and Roundhay", when the 12 terminates at Roundhay Park where it becomes the 2 which then goes through Moortown.
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Post by jabbott1987 on Apr 3, 2008 21:44:02 GMT 1
I think the red & Sky Blue liner's in Huddersfield should have some Eclipse's branded as well, because all the rest of the overground have branding except these.
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Post by hfx on Apr 3, 2008 22:08:22 GMT 1
When 327 was split up into 327 Huddersfield-Birkby (30 mins), and 358 Huddersfield-Ashenhurst circular (20 mins), the Blue Line should have transfered onto route 358 (without any confusion), which runs every 20 minutes. If First have no plans then the 372 should become the Blue line instead and like match with its Red Route!
Service 342 is another service that could become a new overground route, provided first twiddle around with 340 on Sundays. The service runs every 20 minutes for almost all journey's between 8am-6pm Mon-Saturday. The only reason why it's not an overground is due to there being no evening or Sunday service.
372 -This service should be increased to every 10 minutes at peak times. The use of Small Dennis Dart SLFs really jam pack this route up.
I agree with comments about Overground brandings on Huddersfield buses. The pink/Sky-blue/red/green all need brandings. Red line at least should have been branded on B7RLEs. The only problem in doing that is that First around Huddersfield will then end up mis-allocating too many branded vehicles on to other routes. This is not an area known to have right buses on the right route ;D
First Halifax could do with sky blue line brandings(?).
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Post by westyorkshirebus on Apr 3, 2008 22:55:13 GMT 1
I suppose when Huddersfield relaunched the Overground and the new brandings, they didn't want to brand any of the then tatty misc darts that they had. Although the Darts are now smarter they would have reduced the impact of the B7RLEs.
They probably also need a good supply of unbranded vehicles for evenings and sundays when services interwork all over the place
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Post by nick on Apr 4, 2008 8:21:27 GMT 1
Anyway I had a similar idea for Scott Halls, to have a 20-min service to Alwoodley and the other 20-min service to Shadwell. The 71 can then serve Wigton Moor at all times (not every journey, probably every 20 mins daytime) and thus each terminus retains its current guideway service and at better frequencies too. I would number the new service 70 (Shadwell) and 70A (Alwoodley), to co-exist with the 71. So you saying that the 47 would be withdrawn from its current route and be replaced by the 71 which would be extended from Primley Park. 70 would replace the 35 and 70A would replace the 45. I am sure that first had an idea a few years back with another overground route on the corridor the 70 which only lasted around i think it must of been around a year and got withdrawn doing the 47 route at every 10 minutes(or 20 cant remember). One thing i have noticed in bradford's overground network is that they dont have any overground services to the north west (Bignley,Eldwick,Baildon,Shipley). Like i said i think that the 622,623,625(eveing and sundays),626,627(eveing and sundays) could do with becoming a overground!! Your thoughts
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Post by westyorkshirebus on Apr 4, 2008 16:07:40 GMT 1
One thing i have noticed in bradford's overground network is that they dont have any overground services to the north west (Bignley,Eldwick,Baildon,Shipley). Like i said i think that the 622,623,625(eveing and sundays),626,627(eveing and sundays) could do with becoming a overground!! Your thoughts It would be a good idea but the routes are currently too complicated and many parts of the daytime route has no evening/sunday service, whereas other parts are only served at evenings/sundays They would probably have to run buses commercially evenings and sundays matching the daytime routes which would never happen
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