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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2023 10:40:44 GMT 1
These appeared on VOSA today, Arriva changes for the 3rd of September.
PB0000582/41 Registered ARRIVA YORKSHIRE LTD Route: Wakefield to Knottingley Service number: 148 (149, CA1, CA2, SW1) Service type: Normal Stopping Effective date: 03 Sep 2023
PB0000582/277 Registered ARRIVA YORKSHIRE LTD Route: Wakefield to Huddersfield Service number: 231 (232S, HA1, 232) Service type: Normal Stopping Effective date: 03 Sep 2023
PB0000582/242 Registered ARRIVA YORKSHIRE LTD Route: Wakefield to White Rose Centre Service number: 118 Service type: Normal Stopping Effective date: 03 Sep 2023
PB0000582/177 Registered ARRIVA YORKSHIRE LTD Route: Wakefield to Leeds Service number: 444 (446) Service type: Normal Stopping Effective date: 03 Sep 2023
PB0000582/71 Registered ARRIVA YORKSHIRE LTD Route: Wakefield to Pinderfields Service number: 111 (111) Service type: Normal Stopping Effective date: 03 Sep 2023
PB0000582/289 Registered ARRIVA YORKSHIRE LTD Route: Alverthorpe to Wakefield Service number: 104 Service type: Normal Stopping Effective date: 03 Sep 2023
PB0000582/3 Registered ARRIVA YORKSHIRE LTD Route: Pinderfields to Wakefield Service number: 102 (103) Service type: Normal Stopping Effective date: 03 Sep 2023
PB0000582/7 Registered ARRIVA YORKSHIRE LTD Route: Wakefield to Pontefract Service number: 147 Service type: Normal Stopping Effective date: 03 Sep 2023
PB0000582/206 Registered ARRIVA YORKSHIRE LTD Route: Woodkirk Academy to East Ardsley Service number: WA1 (WA1) Service type: Normal Stopping Effective date: 03 Sep 2023
PB0000582/204 Registered ARRIVA YORKSHIRE LTD Route: Outwood Grange Academy to Kirkhamgate Service number: OG2 (OG3, OG2) Service type: Normal Stopping Effective date: 03 Sep 2023
PB0000582/181 Registered ARRIVA YORKSHIRE LTD Route: Wakefield to Durkar Service number: 107 Service type: Normal Stopping Effective date: 03 Sep 2023
PB0000582/23 Registered ARRIVA YORKSHIRE LTD Route: Wakefield to Bradford Service number: 425 (425) Service type: Normal Stopping Effective date: 03 Sep 2023
PB0000582/22 Registered ARRIVA YORKSHIRE LTD Route: Wakefield to Doncaster Service number: 496 Service type: Normal Stopping Effective date: 03 Sep 2023
PB0000582/6 Registered ARRIVA YORKSHIRE LTD Route: Leeds to Wakefield Service number: 110 Service type: Normal Stopping Effective date: 03 Sep 2023
147 and 148 are down for route changes. 102 getting route and timetable change looks like its going to Pinderfields, according to the registration.
The rest of them are timetable changes.
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mattb7tl
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Post by mattb7tl on Jul 24, 2023 15:16:44 GMT 1
I hope these changes are positive, don't want to take back my praise. In other service changes... Stagecoach apparently hasn't even placed a bid for the 398/399. It didn't make sense for them to run it anyways, all of their depots are way too far away.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2023 15:25:51 GMT 1
I hope these changes are positive, don't want to take back my praise. In other service changes... Stagecoach apparently hasn't even placed a bid for the 398/399. It didn't make sense for them to run it anyways, all of their depots are way too far away. It's a positive that no routes been fully cancelled (yet at least),although it would be good to see 110 return to Every 10 Mins but I doubt that will be happening. Over Stagecoach & the 398/9 - Whilst they might not have bid there is only 13 Miles between Storthes Hall & Barnsley depot what is similar if not less that some of the dead milage on contracts they've picked up around other parts of the country.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2023 15:35:50 GMT 1
Stagecoach used to do the 153, how far is that from Barnsley to Castleford? That would have done some dead milage. Globe do this every sunday with the 177.
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Post by peteleeds on Jul 24, 2023 17:58:55 GMT 1
Stagecoach used to do the 153, how far is that from Barnsley to Castleford? That would have done some dead milage. Globe do this every sunday with the 177. If i remember right the mid day changeovers got done at cas with driver getting train from Barnsley
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2023 20:48:00 GMT 1
Stagecoach used to do the 153, how far is that from Barnsley to Castleford? That would have done some dead milage. Globe do this every sunday with the 177. If i remember right the mid day changeovers got done at cas with driver getting train from Barnsley Yes but a driver still had to bring the bus empty from Barnsley to Cas to start the day and another driver took the bus back once the 153 route was finished for the day.
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Post by deerfold on Jul 24, 2023 20:53:56 GMT 1
If i remember right the mid day changeovers got done at cas with driver getting train from Barnsley Yes but a driver still had to bring the bus empty from Barnsley to Cas to start the day and another driver took the bus back once the 153 route was finished for the day. You're saying they didn't take it on the train?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2023 20:57:26 GMT 1
Yes but a driver still had to bring the bus empty from Barnsley to Cas to start the day and another driver took the bus back once the 153 route was finished for the day. You're saying they didn't take it on the train? Well the driver who took over from the 1st driver would have got the train to cas, and the driver who drove the bus first, would get the train back.
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Post by deerfold on Jul 24, 2023 21:05:55 GMT 1
You're saying they didn't take it on the train? Well the driver who took over from the 1st driver would have got the train to cas, and the driver who drove the bus first, would get the train back. Clearly (unless there was an outstation).
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2023 21:10:34 GMT 1
Well the driver who took over from the 1st driver would have got the train to cas, and the driver who drove the bus first, would get the train back. Clearly (unless there was an outstation). But the point I was making and perhaps should have worded in a better way, is that Stagecoach are probably used to the dead mileage, so I can't it seeing it being an issue for them. Wonder if there was any dead running to Leeds on the X10, or did the all start at Barnsley?
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Steve Macz403
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Post by Steve Macz403 on Jul 24, 2023 21:21:41 GMT 1
Clearly (unless there was an outstation). But the point I was making and perhaps should have worded in a better way, is that Stagecoach are probably used to the dead mileage, so I can't it seeing it being an issue for them. Wonder if there was any dead running to Leeds on the X10, or did the all start at Barnsley? Not to go off topic remember when Stagecoach for a brief time did some Sunday Evening 444 and 425 workings. Ran them off a 59 workings. Anyways hopefully this can go back to topic.
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i901
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Post by i901 on Jul 24, 2023 22:20:49 GMT 1
If i remember right the mid day changeovers got done at cas with driver getting train from Barnsley Yes but a driver still had to bring the bus empty from Barnsley to Cas to start the day and another driver took the bus back once the 153 route was finished for the day. Correct, first driver took the bus dead from Barnsley depot and worked the morning part of the service. Second driver got a train from Barnsley to Castleford (the company got a season ticket), exchanged the ticket for the bus with the first driver at Castleford (they got the train back to Barnsley) and worked the afternoon service, taking the bus (usually a Solo) back to Barnsley depot at the end of the shift. If the trains were disrupted a ferry car or other bus was used to do the driver swap. As others have noted, Stagecoach have worked Wakefield-Bradford and Wakefield-Leeds before (with a fair amount of dead running) and indeed at present there are numerous dead runs from Barnsley and Rawmarsh depots to/from Doncaster amongst other large chunks of dead mileage. Provided such costs have been factored in to tenders or are an acceptable commercial 'hit' dead mileage isn't a massive issue
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i901
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Post by i901 on Jul 24, 2023 22:21:43 GMT 1
Clearly (unless there was an outstation). But the point I was making and perhaps should have worded in a better way, is that Stagecoach are probably used to the dead mileage, so I can't it seeing it being an issue for them. Wonder if there was any dead running to Leeds on the X10, or did the all start at Barnsley? All X10 workings started/ended at Barnsley
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hstjohnny
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Post by hstjohnny on Jul 25, 2023 1:28:42 GMT 1
If i remember right the mid day changeovers got done at cas with driver getting train from Barnsley Yes but a driver still had to bring the bus empty from Barnsley to Cas to start the day and another driver took the bus back once the 153 route was finished for the day. IIRC 153/154 was interworked at start/end of the day with a 28 that extended to/from Castleford so ran in service all the way back to Barnsley
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Post by dwarfer1979 on Jul 25, 2023 8:16:35 GMT 1
Yes but a driver still had to bring the bus empty from Barnsley to Cas to start the day and another driver took the bus back once the 153 route was finished for the day. Correct, first driver took the bus dead from Barnsley depot and worked the morning part of the service. Second driver got a train from Barnsley to Castleford (the company got a season ticket), exchanged the ticket for the bus with the first driver at Castleford (they got the train back to Barnsley) and worked the afternoon service, taking the bus (usually a Solo) back to Barnsley depot at the end of the shift. If the trains were disrupted a ferry car or other bus was used to do the driver swap. As others have noted, Stagecoach have worked Wakefield-Bradford and Wakefield-Leeds before (with a fair amount of dead running) and indeed at present there are numerous dead runs from Barnsley and Rawmarsh depots to/from Doncaster amongst other large chunks of dead mileage. Provided such costs have been factored in to tenders or are an acceptable commercial 'hit' dead mileage isn't a massive issue The issue wouldn't be dead mileage per bus but the more general issue of running such an intensive operation so far from their core base (driver breaks & reliefs and vehicle layovers plus how easy it is to support when things go wrong). It is quite peaky so they may be able to get away without sending many reliefs up from Barnsley during the day but you then have to deal with breaks & bus parking in Huddersfield and it is a long day on some workings so driver swaps will be needed. Larger, and more unionised, operators will often have quite restrictive agreements about remote breaks away from designated relief locations and bus stations can have restrictions on how long you can park a bus up (in both cases I don't know what the specifics are in this case but it needs to be considered) which will affect your costs, it may be possible to come to agreement with the Uni (& Union to have this as a designated break location) to use a room at Storthes Hall with access to facilities (we do this on one of our Uni contracts to avoid ferrying drivers elsewhere) but there isn't really anywhere to park buses on site other than leaving them on the access road (or at least there wasn't when I was living there many years ago) which may not be popular. As you say none of these are insurmountable and as long as they are correctly priced in then it isn't preventative but it all pushes up the costs of a remote operator to make it harder for them to win it.
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Post by dlspotter on Jul 25, 2023 17:20:31 GMT 1
Yes but a driver still had to bring the bus empty from Barnsley to Cas to start the day and another driver took the bus back once the 153 route was finished for the day. IIRC 153/154 was interworked at start/end of the day with a 28 that extended to/from Castleford so ran in service all the way back to Barnsley Maybe some years before it ended, but in its latter days (at least 2018/2019) I remember the bus that ran it would pass me out of service outside Pinderfields at roughly 5:15pm
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Post by dlspotter on Jul 25, 2023 17:37:35 GMT 1
Back to September 2023 changes: The 36 will go back to every 10 minutes after the works are complete, with timetable changes on the 1 & 2 additionally. Aireline 60 to go to every 20 minutes Leeds - Shipley, with service 60A complementing running a slightly different route in Rodley, running along Bagley Lane, Coal Hill Lane and Calverley Lane to replace the old 508 K2 & K3 will provide a combined every 10 minute frequency K6 will have a slight route alteration for Oakbank School K7 will increase to every 12 minutes, in addition to timetable alterations on the 64 & 72, K1, K4, K6, K9, K14 & K15 A1 will reduce to every 30 minutes Monday - Saturday with morning service withdrawals Early and late services on A2 and A3 being curtailed or cut, www.transdevbus.co.uk/flyer/changes-times-flyer for details
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Post by Username on Jul 25, 2023 20:44:19 GMT 1
Surprised how Team Pennine have stayed quiet on this one despite most of their contracted services being up for renewal this September. This is stated by this tendered service document for September 2020 stating the contracts will expire on the 26th of August 2023. www.wymetro.com/media/6116/calderdale-batch-679-august-2020.pdfUnless they're still deciding whose won each contract?
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Post by northerner on Jul 25, 2023 20:51:42 GMT 1
Back to September 2023 changes: The 36 will go back to every 10 minutes after the works are complete, with timetable changes on the 1 & 2 additionally. Aireline 60 to go to every 20 minutes Leeds - Shipley, with service 60A complementing running a slightly different route in Rodley, running along Bagley Lane, Coal Hill Lane and Calverley Lane to replace the old 508 K2 & K3 will provide a combined every 10 minute frequency K6 will have a slight route alteration for Oakbank School K7 will increase to every 12 minutes, in addition to timetable alterations on the 64 & 72, K1, K4, K6, K9, K14 & K15 A1 will reduce to every 30 minutes Monday - Saturday with morning service withdrawals Early and late services on A2 and A3 being curtailed or cut, www.transdevbus.co.uk/flyer/changes-times-flyer for details Some timetables are on Metro's site. In the case of the K2/K3 it seems there's an error as there's duplicate journeys at some times. The K6 reroute should be the K16, possibly a typo on the news article. Flyer's changes are interesting, they seem to have struggled more than most to recruit sufficient drivers so it does seem logical to reduce the A1 to every 30 minutes. Changes to the A3 mean further cuts to evening services between Bradford and Shipley though, following the 626 changes this week.
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Post by jst on Jul 25, 2023 21:08:06 GMT 1
Back to September 2023 changes: The 36 will go back to every 10 minutes after the works are complete, with timetable changes on the 1 & 2 additionally. Aireline 60 to go to every 20 minutes Leeds - Shipley, with service 60A complementing running a slightly different route in Rodley, running along Bagley Lane, Coal Hill Lane and Calverley Lane to replace the old 508 K2 & K3 will provide a combined every 10 minute frequency K6 will have a slight route alteration for Oakbank School K7 will increase to every 12 minutes, in addition to timetable alterations on the 64 & 72, K1, K4, K6, K9, K14 & K15 A1 will reduce to every 30 minutes Monday - Saturday with morning service withdrawals Early and late services on A2 and A3 being curtailed or cut, www.transdevbus.co.uk/flyer/changes-times-flyer for details Perhaps more worryingly according to the Metro site the last two journeys from the Airport to Leeds at 2305 & 0005 will now be Friday only. Based on tonight (acknowledgement that flight timetables aren't the same everyday!) there are 9 flights into LBA which currently have a bus to Leeds that now won't! Very poor show.
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WYBS
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Post by WYBS on Jul 25, 2023 21:20:47 GMT 1
Also interesting to note that the now-hourly A1 evening service will depart Leeds at the exact same time as the 60. I mean what is the point?
You could have fooled me with the whole 'low passenger numbers' thing. Every A1 I have been on and seen in recent months has been very busy.
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Post by nathan58 on Jul 25, 2023 21:28:46 GMT 1
Any planned changes for team pennine particularly the D1? Anybody know..
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LukePA
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Post by LukePA on Jul 26, 2023 10:15:24 GMT 1
Just wondering if anyone knows that the route change is to the 148? Just concerned it’s going to be rerouted away from my village.
Thanks in advance
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WYBS
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Post by WYBS on Jul 26, 2023 10:30:22 GMT 1
Back to September 2023 changes: The 36 will go back to every 10 minutes after the works are complete, with timetable changes on the 1 & 2 additionally. Aireline 60 to go to every 20 minutes Leeds - Shipley, with service 60A complementing running a slightly different route in Rodley, running along Bagley Lane, Coal Hill Lane and Calverley Lane to replace the old 508 K2 & K3 will provide a combined every 10 minute frequency K6 will have a slight route alteration for Oakbank School K7 will increase to every 12 minutes, in addition to timetable alterations on the 64 & 72, K1, K4, K6, K9, K14 & K15 A1 will reduce to every 30 minutes Monday - Saturday with morning service withdrawals Early and late services on A2 and A3 being curtailed or cut, www.transdevbus.co.uk/flyer/changes-times-flyer for details Whilst I do appreciate an increase on the 60, my stop in Rodley will be fine but the rest of Rodley will go to a 20/40 split frequency. Rodley has been hit hard with cuts over the past few years and this doesn't improve things. Coal Hill Lane and Calverley Lane are already on, or within a close walk of the 16, 60 and 9. In reality it is people in the centre of Farsley who are missing a direct bus to Kirkstall Road and town. Rerouting the 60 (or 60A as it will be) up Bagley Lane is just a bit silly. I do hope that this means the amount of peak time journeys from Leeds are vastly increased, as we went from a bus every 20 minutes to gaps of 40+ minutes.
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Post by SCH117X on Jul 26, 2023 12:29:22 GMT 1
Back to September 2023 changes: The 36 will go back to every 10 minutes after the works are complete, with timetable changes on the 1 & 2 additionally. The 2 is simply changed timings at one stop. "The 1" is a bit mysterious at present - www.transdevbus.co.uk/harrogate/changes-our-buses-harrogate "The congestion on Knaresborough Road has been making it really difficult for us to run to time recently. With this in mind, we’re making some changes to improve our reliability on the 1. Our frequency will stay the same." There also some changes timings of the 8 Monday-Friday " 4.21pm from Knaresborough to Wetherby will run at 4.41pm , the 4.55pm from Wetherby will run at 5.15pm and the 6pm from Harrogate will run at 6.15pm"
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