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Post by md191077 on Mar 28, 2024 10:25:02 GMT 1
Has this been a rushed job, why are drivers not route trained for routes. 184 still only operating via its scheduled route via Mount Road 1 in 13 times since Sunday's inauguration as a BeeNetwork route, people left stranded. To an extent, the fact that the change of operator and change of service (routes moved between depots for instance) happened on the same day will have made this process more difficult as technically most of these drivers weren't "Stagecoach's" until the day of the change and no matter how much co-operation there is from the previous operator there will always be a level of friction in getting drivers properly trained & briefed on new work. Not all drivers are as committed to the career of bus driving as to be prepared to do extra outside their core hours (even if paid) to get trained and not all drivers will learn in the same way and follow briefing notes clearly - when they are your drivers you know who you can just give the instruction and they will follow (& read) and which you need to take aside and go through in more detail one-on-one but when they are new to you it won't be clear. What the Bee Network is confirming, something that is known to those who have been through similar but wasn't widely understood by those who hadn't, is that drivers aren't always logical on who and where they are prepared to work and the moment you shake anything up you get surprises falling out. You will have drivers who don't want to work in specific places, for specific companies (it may be they previously worked for the new operator and didn't like it) or want to do specific type of duties that are no longer available or not do certain duties/routes that the changes mean they now have to cover and so will look to move to somewhere that fits them better. You will also find that any change like this may simply be the opportunity for someone who was dissatisfied to get out, you can force an employer to take someone on via TUPE but you can't force someone to move to a different employer by it (this being different to a company takeover where your employer hasn't changed just who owns your employer). You know what people are like, someone was going to report it to Huddersfield Examiner. I think we just expect an advertised scheduled service to operate. If there are no 'physical' barriers (ie road closures wtc) I appreciate what you are saying, but Mr Public, unless you have experience or knowledge of how services are actually operated, scheduled and run will understand
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Post by md191077 on Mar 28, 2024 10:54:01 GMT 1
Has this been a rushed job, why are drivers not route trained for routes. 184 still only operating via its scheduled route via Mount Road 1 in 13 times since Sunday's inauguration as a BeeNetwork route, people left stranded. Not so sure they can call themselves stranded lol, a majority own cars up that way and they still have the 938 plus it's only a 20 minute walk to Marsden itself for other buses and yes I know Marsden is a bit in the wild side but it's not that remote so I'm sure a taxi to Marsden station can be summoned quickly up in the sticks lol. Can't believe they see themselves as stranded, hell fire they're worse than some of the folk up Cross Green/East End Park who call themselves stranded after 6/7pm and on Sundays when the 87 was taken off, and these are folk who are more than capable of walking! They can call themselves very lucky up Hard End, with so few homes up that way and so many with cars if it were my decision I'd have the 184 stick to the main road, makes it simpler for drivers to learn for a start, probably quicker on the A62 with no cars to navigate than on Mount Road despite it being half a mile longer too. They'd still have the 938 which is ideal for the narrowness of the road due to parked cars and is an ideal size bus for passenger numbers bearing in mind I've caught/seen buses up that way on different days up that way for years (well bottom of the hill anyway for access to Wessenden) and they've always been lightly loaded. I wouldn't say I was left stranded, but you know what people are like, people gossip and someone was going to the Huddersfield Examiner about it. We just expect an advertised scheduled service to operate, when no physical barriers (road closures etc) are in place. It was the fact that no-one has/had answers about the service (WYCA or Bee Network). Absolutely agree with the parked car issues on Mount Road 'you csn only just get a bus through' Regarding car ownership and Passenger number and access to other services the 383 from Dirker for example...Passengers have access to Marsden station 5 to 7 minutes walk. Cars are parked on one side of Dirker Drive, many houses on the same side have drives with thier cars in, the number of properties may be around 25% more than Mount Road, Netherly Drive and Binn Road, if You include Reddisher Road by station, Dirker Avenue, Dirker Bamk and Plains. All these have similar walking distance perhaps less to Manchester Road than from Hard End. If the service was withdrawn from Hard End so be it, we would get used to it, There is the 938 available as you say and South Pennine Community Transport is an excellent and experienced 'rural' community operater. I have been walking to catch a 383 from village all week and back up that hill (for reliability) I am sure it is good for my health. Mmy initial comments is an advertised and scheduled service is failing to operate.
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Post by Father Dougal McGuire on Mar 28, 2024 11:13:51 GMT 1
Had a day off Yesterday so thought I would try and sample the 'Bee Network' however the 1335 from Huddersfield arrived qt 1348, went out private and commenced service from Longroyd Bridge (between Huddersfield and Cowersley) the next one commenced service at Marsden Hard End to go back to Oldham. All services running in excess of 20 minutes late. Didn't see one that was on time. Was going to do the 1735 Huddersfield to Pldham then the 409 and 590 combination home as it would have connected nicely but it came in late so didn't bother. Also none of them seemed to operate via Linthwaite Church either but are serving Marsden Hard End Not a great first week on this service.
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Post by steve440 on Mar 28, 2024 14:29:10 GMT 1
Had a day off Yesterday so thought I would try and sample the 'Bee Network' however the 1335 from Huddersfield arrived qt 1348, went out private and commenced service from Longroyd Bridge (between Huddersfield and Cowersley) the next one commenced service at Marsden Hard End to go back to Oldham. All services running in excess of 20 minutes late. Didn't see one that was on time. Was going to do the 1735 Huddersfield to Pldham then the 409 and 590 combination home as it would have connected nicely but it came in late so didn't bother. Also none of them seemed to operate via Linthwaite Church either but are serving Marsden Hard End Not a great first week on this service. They're not supposed to go via Linthwaite Church anyway.
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Post by deerfold on Mar 28, 2024 15:16:57 GMT 1
Had a day off Yesterday so thought I would try and sample the 'Bee Network' however the 1335 from Huddersfield arrived qt 1348, went out private and commenced service from Longroyd Bridge (between Huddersfield and Cowersley) the next one commenced service at Marsden Hard End to go back to Oldham. All services running in excess of 20 minutes late. Didn't see one that was on time. Was going to do the 1735 Huddersfield to Pldham then the 409 and 590 combination home as it would have connected nicely but it came in late so didn't bother. Also none of them seemed to operate via Linthwaite Church either but are serving Marsden Hard End Not a great first week on this service. They're not supposed to go via Linthwaite Church anyway. Though at least two each way have today. According to Bustimes.org there's been at least 3 different routes taken through Linthwaite.
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Post by michael1971 on Mar 28, 2024 15:33:36 GMT 1
been checking on bustimes today 184 has been running Mount road only and nearly near to the timetable times
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Post by steve440 on Mar 28, 2024 18:26:49 GMT 1
They're not supposed to go via Linthwaite Church anyway. Though at least two each way have today. According to Bustimes.org there's been at least 3 different routes taken through Linthwaite. It's not good is it. How difficult is it to issue correct instructions to each driver on the route. They only need to put a note on the running board surely.
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mattb7tl
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Post by mattb7tl on Mar 28, 2024 18:40:28 GMT 1
Tranche 3: Hyde Road large franchise – Metroline Sharston large franchise – Metroline Wythenshawe large franchise – Metroline Stockport large franchise – Stagecoach Tameside large franchise – Metroline Tameside A small franchise – Go North West Tameside B small franchise – Diamond Trafford small franchise – Diamond Stockport small franchise – Diamond
Very interesting.
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Post by rodneytrotter on Mar 28, 2024 20:09:57 GMT 1
Metroline is the one that sticks out to me from Tranche 3.
No more Arriva in that area anymore and Stagecoach has lost quite a bit!
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Post by mattb7tl on Mar 28, 2024 21:18:35 GMT 1
Metroline is the one that sticks out to me from Tranche 3. No more Arriva in that area anymore and Stagecoach has lost quite a bit! Absolutely Arriva didn't bid due to the company takeover but then again their operations in that area were quite miniscule. Can't wait for the competition when it is time for our bids. Leeds and Halifax? I think they'll have bids from anywhere and everywhere!
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mattb7tl
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Post by mattb7tl on Mar 28, 2024 22:22:54 GMT 1
First placed bids for T3 A person relatively high up within the company said they are convinced they didn't win any of the depots due to the poor performance by Avanti/TPE. Based.
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Steve Macz403
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Post by Steve Macz403 on Mar 28, 2024 22:52:35 GMT 1
This is from speculation. I’ve heard Stagecoach may win Stockport Large - ( as Stockports getting a large number Volvo BZL/ MCV Doubles and singles for 2024 ) Hyde Road Large / Sharston Large could be the ones that go and shift to Comfort Delgro. There’s also other rumours such as Transport Uk ( Abellio ) and RATP are also in the running too for bids. The Wythenshawe Large contract will be the interesting one as Arriva will forfeit this garage. Arriva North West are going back to concentrate in Merseyside. Taking their buses too once the changeover commences. I did read that Stagecoach were quaking in their boots for Tranche 3. Especially after the big Tranche 2 win. So I guess my speculation was 90% correct - Comfort Delgro / Metroline taking the large swath of South Manchester. Wythenshawe / Sharston / Hyde Road / Ashton large depots. I’ve been on several Metroline buses in North West London and the bus routes they seem to deliver. That leaves Stagecoach with Stockport. Which is going bulk Electric Soon.
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Steve Macz403
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Post by Steve Macz403 on Mar 28, 2024 22:58:39 GMT 1
First placed bids for T3 A person relatively high up within the company said they are convinced they didn't win any of the depots due to the poor performance by Avanti/TPE. Based. I’ve always thought First to try and bid for Manchester an odd one . After they’ve sold depots to GNW ( Queens Road ) and Stagecoach ( Wigan ) . Is a bit odd. I think they may have been last ( ironically not first ) in the pecking order.
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Post by deerfold on Mar 28, 2024 23:02:13 GMT 1
First placed bids for T3 A person relatively high up within the company said they are convinced they didn't win any of the depots due to the poor performance by Avanti/TPE. Based. I’ve always thought First to try and bid for Manchester an odd one . After they’ve sold depots to GNW ( Queens Road ) and Stagecoach ( Wigan ) . Is a bit odd. I think they may have been last ( ironically not first ) in the pecking order. Why would that affect their bids?
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Steve Macz403
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Post by Steve Macz403 on Mar 28, 2024 23:03:50 GMT 1
I’ve always thought First to try and bid for Manchester an odd one . After they’ve sold depots to GNW ( Queens Road ) and Stagecoach ( Wigan ) . Is a bit odd. I think they may have been last ( ironically not first ) in the pecking order. Why would that affect their bids? Who knows. I don’t necessarily know how bidding works.
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Post by rodneytrotter on Mar 28, 2024 23:05:33 GMT 1
If Arriva take their Wythenshawe buses with them, itd at least thered be spare buses for Arriva to send to various parts of the country too, which isn't a bad thing at all, considering the fleet problems Arriva have
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WYBS
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Post by WYBS on Mar 29, 2024 13:24:59 GMT 1
A slight difference in timetables on the 184 too. Huddersfield Bus Station realtime display showing departure at 12:33, whereas the TFGM website and bustimes show 12:35.
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Post by michael1971 on Mar 29, 2024 19:36:19 GMT 1
A slight difference in timetables on the 184 too. Huddersfield Bus Station realtime display showing departure at 12:33, whereas the TFGM website and bustimes show 12:35. thats because it has been Sunday service in Greater Manchester today and Sunday times is 33 mins past even hours from Huddersfield
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Post by WYBS on Mar 29, 2024 19:51:31 GMT 1
A slight difference in timetables on the 184 too. Huddersfield Bus Station realtime display showing departure at 12:33, whereas the TFGM website and bustimes show 12:35. thats because it has been Sunday service in Greater Manchester today and Sunday times is 33 mins past even hours from Huddersfield Fair enough, somehow managed to bash around the Bee Network today whilst looking at Saturday timetables, and still made all my connections spot on. Strange haha.
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Post by michael1971 on Mar 29, 2024 20:45:34 GMT 1
thats because it has been Sunday service in Greater Manchester today and Sunday times is 33 mins past even hours from Huddersfield Fair enough, somehow managed to bash around the Bee Network today whilst looking at Saturday timetables, and still made all my connections spot on. Strange haha. i was in Huddersfield and 10612 broke down there so had to wait for next one 11259 brand new 24 reg service van came out to broken bus
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Post by deerfold on Mar 29, 2024 20:51:02 GMT 1
thats because it has been Sunday service in Greater Manchester today and Sunday times is 33 mins past even hours from Huddersfield Fair enough, somehow managed to bash around the Bee Network today whilst looking at Saturday timetables, and still made all my connections spot on. Strange haha. You were lucky you didn't try the hot before or after on the 184!
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Post by Burnside on Mar 30, 2024 21:11:51 GMT 1
So am i right in thinking that with the exception of 1 group of school routes going to Vision Bus of Blackrod, no small or medium independant operator has won anything at all in the first 3 tranches?
If i were in charge of a similar company in West Yorkshire, i'd be fearing the worst ahead of franchising here.
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Post by stephen01 on Mar 30, 2024 21:27:18 GMT 1
So am i right in thinking that with the exception of 1 group of school routes going to Vision Bus of Blackrod, no small or medium independant operator has won anything at all in the first 3 tranches? If i were in charge of a similar company in West Yorkshire, i'd be fearing the worst ahead of franchising here. they all are which is why all independants except South Pennine pushed for the EP+ as it would have brought services under control WITHOUT costing the taxpayer & passengers and was fairer. Also i have been told what the proposed livery will be and all i'll say is you'll need very dark sunglasses and want the ground to swallow you up when a bus pulls up.
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pricel
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Post by pricel on Mar 30, 2024 21:30:27 GMT 1
So am i right in thinking that with the exception of 1 group of school routes going to Vision Bus of Blackrod, no small or medium independant operator has won anything at all in the first 3 tranches? If i were in charge of a similar company in West Yorkshire, i'd be fearing the worst ahead of franchising here. they all are which is why all independants except South Pennine pushed for the EP+ as it would have brought services under control WITHOUT costing the taxpayer & passengers and was fairer. Also i have been told what the proposed livery will be and all i'll say is you'll need very dark sunglasses and want the ground to swallow you up when a bus pulls up. Heard it's bright pink. If that's true, what a crazy coincidence how Transdev managed to use matching colours for both Rosso and Team Pennine with the franchising liveries.
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Post by rodneytrotter on Mar 30, 2024 21:44:20 GMT 1
I would hate to see the good local operators leave and disappear, Ross Travel, Squarepeg, Stotts, Lyles and Son, all have built excellent relationships with the people who use their routes, and have a dedicated and loyal customer base. I personally think all 4 of these operators are fantastic, I would hate to seem them go!
Quite a few of these, have been around longer than most of us have been alive, have excellent reputations, and have been at the heart of the community.
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