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Post by rossbailey on Apr 30, 2024 22:29:12 GMT 1
And Tracy wants our votes on Thursday.
She is absolutely useless and needs voting out with a new Mayor who might actually get things sorted.
1/ Bradford Interchange closed, 2/Halifax Bus station still not completed and 3/ the ongoing fiasco with the Whiterose Train station where the builders have walked off the site is enough fir me
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Post by westyorkshirebus on Apr 30, 2024 22:31:03 GMT 1
They’ve clearly said ‘closed until June’ so it pushes the deadline substantially past the date of the elections
As there is obviously no work going on, even if it was a simple fix it wouldn’t be open by June.
Once the incumbents are re-elected both as mayor and within Bradford council, they’ll announce it is closed until at least 2025
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Post by rodneytrotter on Apr 30, 2024 23:45:19 GMT 1
and yet people want the WYCA to run franchising for the whole county, Total incompetence and no regard for the public. This has been handled appallingly. Tracy Brabin, WYCA and Bradford Councillors should be ashamed of themselves, I seriously hope they don't get back in, people of Bradford deserve better and people in West Yorkshire deserve better.
Seriously, how can anyone want Brabin and Co, to be responsible for franchising when they can't even manage this or handle this or Halifax or the White Rose station.
Sorry, but Brabin and co need to be held accountable for this mess.
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Post by shelf81 on May 1, 2024 0:02:20 GMT 1
And Tracy wants our votes on Thursday. She is absolutely useless and needs voting out with a new Mayor who might actually get things sorted. 1/ Bradford Interchange closed, 2/Halifax Bus station still not completed and 3/ the ongoing fiasco with the Whiterose Train station where the builders have walked off the site is enough fir me potentially you could add 4 & 5 as well, as it's gone quiet over the refurbishments of Huddersfield & Dewsbury Bus Stations, plus wasn't York Road Guideway in Leeds meant to be have been removed by now? Seems to be alot of announcements but little delivery.
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Post by stephen01 on May 1, 2024 8:09:06 GMT 1
And Tracy wants our votes on Thursday. She is absolutely useless and needs voting out with a new Mayor who might actually get things sorted. 1/ Bradford Interchange closed, 2/Halifax Bus station still not completed and 3/ the ongoing fiasco with the Whiterose Train station where the builders have walked off the site is enough fir me potentially you could add 4 & 5 as well, as it's gone quiet over the refurbishments of Huddersfield & Dewsbury Bus Stations, plus wasn't York Road Guideway in Leeds meant to be have been removed by now? Seems to be alot of announcements but little delivery. with 6 been the failure of work happening to convert Heckmondwike hub.
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Post by sharksmith on May 1, 2024 12:27:48 GMT 1
And Tracy wants our votes on Thursday. She is absolutely useless and needs voting out with a new Mayor who might actually get things sorted. 1/ Bradford Interchange closed, 2/Halifax Bus station still not completed and 3/ the ongoing fiasco with the Whiterose Train station where the builders have walked off the site is enough fir me Unfortunately I don't see any chance of a change of mayor this week. People who actually bother to vote seem to come in a few different types. 1 The ones who have always voted for one party and always will. Quite often a generational thing passed down through families. 2. The ones who vote in all elections based on National Politics rather than on the issues the candidates can actually affect. Not going to get those voters voting Tory at the moment. 3. The small clued up proportion who actually know which positions they are voting people into. Category 3 are unfortunately a very small minority, and apart from in the most marginal of areas cannot affect the outcomes. Even in this small cross section of well informed voters, many will have their own personal priorities of which transport may not be one. I expect a large win for the current mayor with probably an increased share of the vote. ☹️
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mattb7tl
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Post by mattb7tl on May 1, 2024 13:39:19 GMT 1
I'm confused people complain about the interchange but want them to rush a bus station instead of taking their time to build a higher quality more durable station? Is there just no winning? I also don't understand how the construction issues have anything to do with Tracy? Do we expect her to go do a apprenticeship in construction and spend every day micromanaging every move on the site?
Since the authority is apparently responsible for construction as it gets built, would someone remind me what party was in charge when the interchange was getting built?
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Post by shelf81 on May 1, 2024 14:11:05 GMT 1
I'm confused people complain about the interchange but want them to rush a bus station instead of taking their time to build a higher quality more durable station? Is there just no winning? I also don't understand how the construction issues have anything to do with Tracy? Do we expect her to go do a apprenticeship in construction and spend every day micromanaging every move on the site? Since the authority is apparently responsible for construction as it gets built, would someone remind me what party was in charge when the interchange was getting built? Nobody is expecting Brabin to build it herself, but as she's the leader of WYCA surely she needs to take some responsibility for the poor information & replacements being offered in Bradford plus maybe expect her not to keep announcing new projects whilst non of the previous ones have been completed (or started). Over you question about the part in charge when the Interchange (assuming you mean the 2001 version) was built, it was under a Labour Government whilst Bradford Council had a Labour majority but with no overhaul control & is now both the Labour Councils & Labour Mayors responsibility to get it sorted. I think we all know if they could find a way to blame the Tories they would of already done so.
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mattb7tl
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Post by mattb7tl on May 1, 2024 14:24:12 GMT 1
I'm confused people complain about the interchange but want them to rush a bus station instead of taking their time to build a higher quality more durable station? Is there just no winning? I also don't understand how the construction issues have anything to do with Tracy? Do we expect her to go do a apprenticeship in construction and spend every day micromanaging every move on the site? Since the authority is apparently responsible for construction as it gets built, would someone remind me what party was in charge when the interchange was getting built? Nobody is expecting Brabin to build it herself, but as she's the leader of WYCA surely she needs to take some responsibility for the poor information & replacements being offered in Bradford plus maybe expect her not to keep announcing new projects whilst non of the previous ones have been completed (or started). Over you question about the part in charge when the Interchange (assuming you mean the 2001 version) was built, it was under a Labour Government whilst Bradford Council had a Labour majority but with no overhaul control & is now both the Labour Councils & Labour Mayors responsibility to get it sorted. I think we all know if they could find a way to blame the Tories they would of already done so. Why was the void in the ground there in the first place? The issues stem below the bus station, not on top. (So I'm refering to the original interchange)
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Post by shelf81 on May 1, 2024 14:38:23 GMT 1
Nobody is expecting Brabin to build it herself, but as she's the leader of WYCA surely she needs to take some responsibility for the poor information & replacements being offered in Bradford plus maybe expect her not to keep announcing new projects whilst non of the previous ones have been completed (or started). Over you question about the part in charge when the Interchange (assuming you mean the 2001 version) was built, it was under a Labour Government whilst Bradford Council had a Labour majority but with no overhaul control & is now both the Labour Councils & Labour Mayors responsibility to get it sorted. I think we all know if they could find a way to blame the Tories they would of already done so. Why was the void in the ground there in the first place? The issues stem below the bus station, not on top. (So I'm refering to the original interchange) Isn't the void ground due to it previously being a depot under there, hence the issue was with the 2001 rebuild? or are you meaning a different area? The original Interchange was opened about year before the current council setup was formed, but for the most part was made under Labour local control & a mix of Labour & Tory Prime Minsters (Bradford Int was designed & built between 1962 > 1973, 1962 > 64 under Tories,64 > 70 under Labour & 70 > 73 back under Tories)
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mattb7tl
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Post by mattb7tl on May 1, 2024 15:43:18 GMT 1
Why was the void in the ground there in the first place? The issues stem below the bus station, not on top. (So I'm refering to the original interchange) Isn't the void ground due to it previously being a depot under there, hence the issue was with the 2001 rebuild? or are you meaning a different area? The original Interchange was opened about year before the current council setup was formed, but for the most part was made under Labour local control & a mix of Labour & Tory Prime Minsters (Bradford Int was designed & built between 1962 > 1973, 1962 > 64 under Tories,64 > 70 under Labour & 70 > 73 back under Tories) The reality is when we deal with something annoying and frustrating we want to point fingers and put the blame on someone or something. Politicians aren't the ones to blame in this scenario, or crazy concept, maybe nobody is to blame! The authority took the word of professional surveyors with the construction of the new interchange, and with the majority of structural damages being the result of the original construction with 'incorrect workmanship' or 'incorrect materials' what was acceptable at their point of survey may be different to now. That also means maintenance wouldn't have done much to prevent this issue, only prolong it, because the probability is that the building or depot in the 1970s, was fundamentally flawed when constructed. The issue of flooding in the basement also ups that probability. buildsafe.co.uk/what-causes-structural-damage/#:~:text=Primary%20causes%20of%20structural%20defects,dampness%2C%20plumbing%20issues%20etc
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Post by rodneytrotter on May 1, 2024 15:55:48 GMT 1
Well you certainly have to blame Brabin, WYCA and councillors for the poor and abysmal information they have given to the public and the bus companies as well. Utterly horrendous.
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mattb7tl
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Post by mattb7tl on May 1, 2024 16:04:22 GMT 1
Well you certainly have to blame Brabin, WYCA and councillors for the poor and abysmal information they have given to the public and the bus companies as well. Utterly horrendous. Of course The information from both sides has been dreadful but blaming them, or anyone, for the collapse? It seems like a big reach. Unfortunate things can happen without it being the fault of someone else. We live and we learn, and it appears we loved and learnt afterwards, instead of beforehand.
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Post by shelf81 on May 1, 2024 16:15:49 GMT 1
Isn't the void ground due to it previously being a depot under there, hence the issue was with the 2001 rebuild? or are you meaning a different area? The original Interchange was opened about year before the current council setup was formed, but for the most part was made under Labour local control & a mix of Labour & Tory Prime Minsters (Bradford Int was designed & built between 1962 > 1973, 1962 > 64 under Tories,64 > 70 under Labour & 70 > 73 back under Tories) The reality is when we deal with something annoying and frustrating we want to point fingers and put the blame on someone or something. Politicians aren't the ones to blame in this scenario, or crazy concept, maybe nobody is to blame! The authority took the word of professional surveyors with the construction of the new interchange, and with the majority of structural damages being the result of the original construction with 'incorrect workmanship' or 'incorrect materials' what was acceptable at their point of survey may be different to now. That also means maintenance wouldn't have done much to prevent this issue, only prolong it, because the probability is that the building or depot in the 1970s, was fundamentally flawed when constructed. The issue of flooding in the basement also ups that probability. buildsafe.co.uk/what-causes-structural-damage/#:~:text=Primary%20causes%20of%20structural%20defects,dampness%2C%20plumbing%20issues%20etc Can you honestly say the WYCA/Council are totally blameless & have done a fantastic job during this mess? Surely even when you like other stuff WYCA have done it's only fair to see when criticism is deserved. As you pointed out, it was flawed when constructed with flooding issues, so before they came up with their shopping list of new projects did they do checks to make sure the current infrastructures was upto scratch (not just Bradford Int but all of it) If they didn't then IMO that was an oversight & if they did then they should be sharing what was said & asking why the surveyors at the time didn't see signs this was coming. That's before questioning the original statement being 'Storm Damage' & the Interchange was going to be closed a matter of weeks. Then there was the Council pushing ahead with the city centre closures, the poor information & temporary bus stop locations. When Rotherham Interchange closed they managed to convert a car park into a temporary bus station within 2 months, why hasn't Bradford?
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Post by rwilkes on May 1, 2024 16:29:29 GMT 1
I'm confused people complain about the interchange but want them to rush a bus station instead of taking their time to build a higher quality more durable station? Is there just no winning? I also don't understand how the construction issues have anything to do with Tracy? Do we expect her to go do a apprenticeship in construction and spend every day micromanaging every move on the site? Since the authority is apparently responsible for construction as it gets built, would someone remind me what party was in charge when the interchange was getting built? Nobody is expecting Brabin to build it herself, but as she's the leader of WYCA surely she needs to take some responsibility for the poor information & replacements being offered in Bradford plus maybe expect her not to keep announcing new projects whilst non of the previous ones have been completed (or started). Over you question about the part in charge when the Interchange (assuming you mean the 2001 version) was built, it was under a Labour Government whilst Bradford Council had a Labour majority but with no overhaul control & is now both the Labour Councils & Labour Mayors responsibility to get it sorted. I think we all know if they could find a way to blame the Tories they would of already done so. We might reasonably copmplain about lack of preventative maintenance and surveys. The problems should not have been a surprise.
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Post by pjb on May 1, 2024 16:36:58 GMT 1
I think the main issue with the interchange has been water ingress under the bus station part, this has only been a big issue since metro rebuilt the bus concourse in 2001 and removed the original overall roof which protected the entire surface from water.
Metro has been patch repairing the surface ever since 2001 as a result. They took the decision to do a better job with the program started last year to seal and protect the structure (after a survey said the original structure underneath was still sound).
Move to this year when some concrete fell into the old bus garage below and the place is shut indefinitely. I think it’s highly likely the contractors doing the surface repairs have damaged the structure causing the damage and concrete fall. I wouldn’t be surprised if this isn’t a factor in why things are so quiet now. Last year they also invested in moving the travel centre up to the bus concourse too.
I’d potentially fill the old bus garage underneath to allow the top structure to remain supported.
Also remember this isn’t just a bus problem. It also means currently the railway station has no proper entrance or toilets or facilities as these are shared with the interchange bus station concourse and rail passengers seem to be being overlooked.
There still needs to be decent interchange rail station facilities and entrance irrespective of whether the bus station remains closed or not.
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mattb7tl
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Post by mattb7tl on May 1, 2024 20:48:47 GMT 1
I'm more saying the only terrible thing they have done since she's been elected was the poor information with the interchange. Other than that, targets are being met, and stuff is getting done, maybe not on time, but you can never really predict construction.
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Post by shelf81 on May 1, 2024 21:18:34 GMT 1
I'm more saying the only terrible thing they have done since she's been elected was the poor information with the interchange. Other than that, targets are being met, and stuff is getting done, maybe not on time, but you can never really predict construction. It's almost ironic the the only two things she's been able to get done for transport is the BSIP stuff what required the private operators help & then the franchising what partly removes them. I'd question if from the 6-7 projects that got announced & most should either being worked on or completed, 1 almost complete bus station & 1 half built train station could be labelled 'targets being met'.
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Post by westyorkshirebus on May 1, 2024 21:22:58 GMT 1
You can’t blame the current administration for the fault with the Interchange, but you can blame them for the organisation since
The fact the mayor, the combined authority and the council think the Nelson Street situation is acceptable, and in 4 months has actually got worse, is unacceptable. Has anyone senior actually been down there?
Hundreds of people just loitering on the pavement for tens of different services that may stop anywhere
By now, there should be a better temporary facility, even just more shelters, or loading some buses in Nelson Street car park, but nobody seems to care, as they all know they are untouchable politically
I wonder how much money First are now losing in the city as people just give up using the bus, and give up visiting Bradford entirely
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Post by rodneytrotter on May 1, 2024 21:34:22 GMT 1
You can’t blame the current administration for the fault with the Interchange, but you can blame them for the organisation since The fact the mayor, the combined authority and the council think the Nelson Street situation is acceptable, and in 4 months has actually got worse, is unacceptable. Has anyone senior actually been down there? Hundreds of people just loitering on the pavement for tens of different services that may stop anywhere By now, there should be a better temporary facility, even just more shelters, or loading some buses in Nelson Street car park, but nobody seems to care, as they all know they are untouchable politically I wonder how much money First are now losing in the city as people just give up using the bus, and give up visiting Bradford entirely All you have to do is have a photo opportunity down there in Bradford, and Tracy and co will come running. You get the impression the WYCA that they only care about Leeds and nothing more.
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Post by northerner on May 1, 2024 22:15:50 GMT 1
I wonder how much money First are now losing in the city as people just give up using the bus, and give up visiting Bradford entirely Indeed, this will almost certainly be impacting the wider Bradford economy. For the last 2 days First have been reporting delays in excess of an hour across the Bradford network, so having somewhere comfortable to wait is really important right now. The lack of info from the mayor and WYCA is concerning, especially as Tracy doesn't usually have a problem stepping in front of a camera. The cynic in me thinks had Bradford council been Tory, she would have been much more vocal and take more of an interest.
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joseph
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Post by joseph on May 2, 2024 6:37:58 GMT 1
I just can't wait until 2025 to see the whole City of Culture thing totally collapse partly thanks to poor transport infrastructure and bankrupt the council lol, that'll teach them for wasting money what could and should be better spent elsewhere, such as fixing up a temporary bus station for example.
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Post by deerfold on May 2, 2024 14:37:58 GMT 1
I just can't wait until 2025 to see the whole City of Culture thing totally collapse partly thanks to poor transport infrastructure and bankrupt the council lol, that'll teach them for wasting money what could and should be better spent elsewhere, such as fixing up a temporary bus station for example. You know the City of Culture receives central government funding? That money couldn't be used for anything else. I'm not sure why you wouldn't want it to be a success for Bradford whether you like the people organising it or not. The benefits or otherwise will be felt by the residents of Bradford, not the organisers. If the council is bankrupted there'll be a lot of losers, locally. Most councils that have gone bankrupt would not have done without cuts to the central government grant they get.
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Post by shelf81 on May 2, 2024 14:44:56 GMT 1
I just can't wait until 2025 to see the whole City of Culture thing totally collapse partly thanks to poor transport infrastructure and bankrupt the council lol, that'll teach them for wasting money what could and should be better spent elsewhere, such as fixing up a temporary bus station for example. Wouldn't it be WYCA paying for a temporary bus station rather than Bradford City Council?
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Post by stephen01 on May 2, 2024 15:20:03 GMT 1
I just can't wait until 2025 to see the whole City of Culture thing totally collapse partly thanks to poor transport infrastructure and bankrupt the council lol, that'll teach them for wasting money what could and should be better spent elsewhere, such as fixing up a temporary bus station for example. Wouldn't it be WYCA paying for a temporary bus station rather than Bradford City Council? it would be both but more WYCA but it depends on if there's a suitable site.
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