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Post by sharksmith on Oct 21, 2018 16:20:06 GMT 1
I was going to ask if we can have a bitching and whining sub board but to be honest it would probably be easier to have a new sub board called 'For Bus Enthusiasts Only' instead.
All I seem to read these days is how awful First/Wright are. Bickering between Transdev and Connexions supporters. The endless cycle of moans about why buses can't keep to time....erm traffic!!! Age profiles of various fleets and the my depot is the worst off depot in Yorkshire whines.
As an enthusiast I would like one section of the forum to keep me informed of new vehicles, movements and withdrawals. Changes to routes and frequencies. New companies, takeovers, mergers and cessations. Unusual sightings and livery changes. All of these without the constant moaning.
Facebook groups are bad enough but sometimes the only post's I see when I check in is someone's gripe. I think this is probably why we have lost so many informative members over the last few years. That and the most insufferable of all posts the 'it's been like that for weeks but I haven't been bothered to report it here because I'm a complete know-it-all and am clearly better than you' post.
I am also aware that this post is a moan but at least I haven't included it under the First repaints or Transdev movements thread.
It's getting close to the 'delete from bookmarks' time for this forum.
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Post by rider5521 on Oct 22, 2018 7:46:05 GMT 1
I was going to ask if we can have a bitching and whining sub board but to be honest it would probably be easier to have a new sub board called 'For Bus Enthusiasts Only' instead. All I seem to read these days is how awful First/Wright are. Bickering between Transdev and Connexions supporters. The endless cycle of moans about why buses can't keep to time....erm traffic!!! Age profiles of various fleets and the my depot is the worst off depot in Yorkshire whines. As an enthusiast I would like one section of the forum to keep me informed of new vehicles, movements and withdrawals. Changes to routes and frequencies. New companies, takeovers, mergers and cessations. Unusual sightings and livery changes. All of these without the constant moaning. Facebook groups are bad enough but sometimes the only post's I see when I check in is someone's gripe. I think this is probably why we have lost so many informative members over the last few years. That and the most insufferable of all posts the 'it's been like that for weeks but I haven't been bothered to report it here because I'm a complete know-it-all and am clearly better than you' post. I am also aware that this post is a moan but at least I haven't included it under the First repaints or Transdev movements thread. It's getting close to the 'delete from bookmarks' time for this forum. Understand totally, I see some of the drivel on here and think what a whinge fest it has become. |
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Steve Macz403
Forum Member
Waits at the bus stop for his bus, 2 days later bus turns up :D
Posts: 1,678
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Post by Steve Macz403 on Oct 22, 2018 20:05:46 GMT 1
There’s some stuff we can’t escape from. I’ll point them out The unreliability of First Bus The unreliability of Arriva Leeds always gets new buses I don’t like the new buses, there not like the old buses. It’s good that we are entitled to our opinions and this is the best outlet to express those opinions. I think it’s more to do with personality The same issues I get from the forum, Are similar to what I get when I work. People bicker, people don’t like others opinions. That’s a human thing. But maybe we all can be politeful. We all do it outside , in work , school, college, uni or wherever. So we can do it on TWY forum.  |
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Post by driver6540 on Oct 23, 2018 22:08:54 GMT 1
Agree totally with the above post,but in West Yorkshire we don't have the chance to whinge about the unreliability of Stagecoach!
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Post by westyorkshirebus on Oct 23, 2018 22:22:03 GMT 1
There’s some stuff we can’t escape from. I’ll point them out The unreliability of First Bus The unreliability of Arriva Leeds always gets new buses I don’t like the new buses, there not like the old buses. It’s good that we are entitled to our opinions and this is the best outlet to express those opinions. I think it’s more to do with personality The same issues I get from the forum, Are similar to what I get when I work. People bicker, people don’t like others opinions. That’s a human thing. But maybe we all can be politeful. We all do it outside , in work , school, college, uni or wherever. So we can do it on TWY forum. If someone at work moaned about the same topic every day regardless of the matter in hand though, you’d probably stop talking to them. Some of the points are valid, but they don’t need mentioning all the time and I’d expect a better understanding of the issues behind the decisions, rather than ill informed rants like you’d get in the comments under a news story in the Telegraph and Argus. Remember the time when almost every Yorkshire Tiger thread turned into the exact same discussion regardless of whether it was about fleet changes, livery changes, service changes. Plus it depends who they are, some posters provide lots of info and sometimes may have a moan to make, others seem to only exist to moan and haven’t ever provided anything of worth. |
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Post by deerfold on Oct 24, 2018 9:32:32 GMT 1
Agree totally with the above post,but in West Yorkshire we don't have the chance to whinge about the unreliability of Stagecoach! Unless you catch the X10 or X62. |
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Post by resolution on Oct 24, 2018 17:21:51 GMT 1
I come to this site because I am interested in public transport. As regards street transport I ceased to be interested in the actual vehicles after the last decent one entered Thornbury depot in 1972 but I remain interested in the services that the stuff that's left provides for those unfortunate enough not to be able to use the railway.
So when I read about new buses I want to know "are they better than the old ones; will they provide a better service?" If they are branded I want to know "is it going to increase patronage? If they aren't going to be used on the 'right' services what effect will it have?"
It's certainly relevant to have a moan if the services don't function properly because we need to know why. Is it because the buses are always breaking down? Is it because of traffic? If it's the traffic, what is local management doing about it, if anything? Is there any local management in the first place?
What drives First fleet policy? Does Leeds get all the new buses because it is more profitable than, say, Halifax? Might Halifax not be profitable because so many of its buses are perceived as rancid junk and might its profitability be improved by new buses?
These are all questions ('moans') which are more important to me than spotting an unusual bus on a particular working. If your interest is so shallow that you don't want to enter into this sort of discussion then fair enough; there was a time when I was just like you and I was quite happy and did no one any harm. But I don't see that it gives you the right to criticise those who see the shortcomings of present-day operations and want to know what, if anything, is being done to correct them.
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Post by westyorkshirebus on Oct 24, 2018 18:24:34 GMT 1
The people who make these moans in every thread are not interested in the answers. If every bus isn’t brand new and bang on time running every 2 minutes then it’s just not good enough and the idiots in charge need to hang their head in shame.
Plus, it looks like the sightings thread, the repaints thread etc etc should be closed as those observations are ‘shallow’
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Post by driver6540 on Oct 24, 2018 21:31:10 GMT 1
I've always thought that this forum is a pretty broad church, catering for all members opinions and viewpoints. It would be pretty bland if we all couldn't post what interests us as individuals for fear of upsetting other members who don't share the same interests. As for the perceived moaners and whingers (boring as they may be), they've got every right as fellow forum members to express an opinion. I do sometimes think though that there's a distinct lack of humour on this forum. Some posts these days seem to be awfully po-faced!
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Post by rwilkes on Nov 16, 2018 21:58:59 GMT 1
I joined because I am interested in bus services and this forum has been good for this, but seem to be getting less so..
I think it would be a better forum if the moderators blocked any rude or clearly ill informed comments.
I swear all the time but never on-line and it would be a good start if everyone took that position.
It would be good to have much more from senior bus insiders but we have to have a bit of self discipline to get that.
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Post by rider5521 on Nov 16, 2018 22:53:16 GMT 1
I joined because I am interested in bus services and this forum has been good for this, but seem to be getting less so.. I think it would be a better forum if the moderators blocked any rude or clearly ill informed comments. I swear all the time but never on-line and it would be a good start if everyone took that position. It would be good to have much more from senior bus insiders but we have to have a bit of self discipline to get that. It's just the nastier world we live in nowadays, sadly social media has brought out the worst in people. When I ran buses (pre social media), there were great sheets that came out full of info (WYIS Etc..), and from that regular meets and events were held, bus industry people would even come and give talks and so on. The new world and this social media should, be a recipie for great interaction, but having seen insiders come on and answer some of the posts, just seems to inflame the situation, and the lack of courtesy shown to them is appalling, given that they have taken time to come and engage. Don't be under any illusion they respond because they care, doubt any company would force a manager to go and speak to some bus enthusiasts on a small forum. There are some great managers who would love to come and discuss issues on here in a sensible manner, the latent immaturity demonstrated sadly prevents good discussion. Shame really, but have to say never really look at it much anymore, the discussions are just too negative, I don't believe all the talented people who run these companies, and the drivers who turn up at all times in all weather's go to work and think "what can I mess up today". I think we should have a "positivity thread", where good natured informed debate can take place, properly moderated, and maybe have a "woe is me" thread where those who just want to see everything through a glass is half empty perspective can moan at each other. |
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Post by Craig on Nov 17, 2018 19:22:19 GMT 1
The clear message is that a majority of members are getting more fed up of the minority of members who are overly opinionated and skew negative with their posts. It’s an enthusiast site but there does appear sometimes to be less and less enthusiasm on here. We are all more passionate about public transport than the average person, by virtue of the fact we have all specifically sought out this niche interest forum. Passion of course leads to frustration where things go wrong and ideas of things that could be improved, but should equally include positivity. However, we are an online forum, and I’ve yet to discover a forum that doesn’t have members who seemingly want to disagree with anything for the sake of it. A recent disappointment has been where industry members, who have taken their own time to come on here and contribute, have received unconstructive, overly negative feedback, when they clearly were trying to engage in a positive dialogue to properly discuss issues.
But here’s the rub: people have different opinions and a proper open forum invites all those opinions to be expressed. This is why separate ‘positive or negative’ sections of the forum is a non-starter as it assumes that those two viewpoints are always independent of each other. Do I agree with everything people say on here? Absolutely not. But myself and Tim won’t ever delete comments based only on this. We do of course delete comments which are purely argumentative or inappropriate in line with the forum rules. And we will remove members who explicitly cause confrontation or just troll everything, which we have done numerous times in the past.
But the bottom line is that if you feel you want more positivity on the forum, you have to bring that, and we all have to accept that views will differ.
I personally would much rather the negative vibe be minimised. If this is the majority view, which it appears to be, let’s all work towards that.
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Post by resolution on Nov 18, 2018 16:53:02 GMT 1
Fair comment. But there is a difference between negative comment and abuse. I have seen very little abuse, either directly or indirectly directed at industry members who have contributed to this forum; we all surely acknowledge that local managers of the large groups have limited input into the overall policy and are as much 'victims' in that sense as we are as passengers. If you want to see abuse, you should see some of the football supporters' forums; I guarantee that you won't be disappointed (although your faith in the human race will take some time to recover!).
Criticism is an entirely different animal; sometimes it is born of ignorance but ignorance itself is not a crime; we are not all party to the inner workings of the industry and if it is not abusive it surely deserves a civilised answer; only by knowing the real reasons for what superficially appears to be incompetence/negligence by operators can we, as supporters of public transport, correct the really negative opinions we hear expressed in pubs and on the street by those even more ignorant than ourselves and put them right.
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