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Post by martinjwdton on Sept 9, 2015 12:13:00 GMT 1
Seen something on Twitter that transdev harrogate extending the 1 to borobridge
Anyone know much about it..... Could cause conflict with connexions 57 also steal more passengers off the x1
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Post by Arriva Wakefield on Sept 9, 2015 14:09:54 GMT 1
Seen something on Twitter that transdev harrogate extending the 1 to borobridge Anyone know much about it..... Could cause conflict with connexions 57 also steal more passengers off the x1 No doubt it'll be another 'trick' so that they can get a tendered service cancelled, and then when passengers complain that it doesn't serve any purpose, it'll be re routed (and paid for by the council). Same as what they've done in York - extended the 44 to Acomb (so the Arriva 13A tender was cancelled), but missing out the Hamilton Drive loop, waited for complaints, and now it goes round Hamilton Drive, but supported by CoYC. |
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jc
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Post by jc on Sept 9, 2015 17:57:48 GMT 1
So would that involve reducing the 1C? It stands to reason that picking up trade on Boroughbridge Road and in Knaresborough would make the service more viable. I assume that the main problem with Boroughbridge in terms of public transport is it's geography, with a more balanced split of trips to York, Ripon, Knaresborough, Harrogate than for example Easingwold with strong flows to York. But it does seem incredible if there isn't the demand for at least a regular, hourly link to somewhere.
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Post by SCH117X on Sept 9, 2015 18:46:51 GMT 1
There are these entries on VOSA
PB0001746/7 - HARROGATE & DISTRICT TRAVEL LTD, PROSPECT PARK, BROUGHTON WAY, STARBECK, HARROGATE, HG2 7NYVariation Accepted: Operating between Harrogate and Knaresborough given service number 1/1a/1b/1bc/1c effective from 01-Nov-2015. To amend Timetable.
PB0001746/77 - HARROGATE & DISTRICT TRAVEL LTD, PROSPECT PARK, BROUGHTON WAY, STARBECK, HARROGATE, HG2 7NYVariation Accepted: Operating between Knaresborough and Kirby Hill given service number 1A effective from 01-Nov-2015. To amend Route and Timetable.
PB0001746/78 - HARROGATE & DISTRICT TRAVEL LTD, PROSPECT PARK, BROUGHTON WAY, STARBECK, HARROGATE, HG2 7NYVariation Accepted: Operating between Knaresborough Bus Station and Eastfield given service number 1B effective from 01-Nov-2015. To amend Timetabled.
PB0001746/79 - HARROGATE & DISTRICT TRAVEL LTD, PROSPECT PARK, BROUGHTON WAY, STARBECK, HARROGATE, HG2 7NYVariation Accepted: Operating between Knaresborouh Bus Station and Carmires given service number 1C effective from 01-Nov-2015. To amend Timetable.
As there is no existing 1A to Kirby Hill suspect its the usual VOSA typo and this has sparked twitters to tweet. Stealing passengers? Is that not what the x1 does?
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Post by stevieinselby on Sept 9, 2015 19:49:18 GMT 1
Irritatingly, VOSA will allow you to see when a service was revised but not to see any details of those revisions. The ticket for the 1A listing Kirby Hill was opened in 2013, although I can't tell if that was the original endpoint or a more recent variation.
However, the entry for the 770 is given as "Leeds to Wetherby" with no mention of Harrogate, so it looks to me as though the endpoints are the original endpoints and aren't changed with subsequent updates - that certainly fits with what I've seen elsewhere.
Which leaves the question, when did the 1A ever serve Kirby Hill? I can't see anything in Knaresborough that might have gone by that name, so is it just a mistake?
I would be amazed if Transdev were planning to serve Boroughbridge commercially, given that they allowed Eddie's to take the contract from them, they didn't attempt to reinstate a service commercially when Eddie's folded, and the subsidy for the route has been cut once in the last 12 months and is set to be slashed again next year, suggesting that there is no patronage to be had.
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Post by Arriva Wakefield on Sept 9, 2015 19:58:56 GMT 1
Straight off @harrogatebus Twitter @harrogatebus: Listen up #Boroughbridge! We're the 1 to watch #harrogate #comingsoon #keepwatching @boroughbridge_ @moreharrogate t.co/a34Zpb2U4S |
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jc
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Post by jc on Sept 9, 2015 20:30:26 GMT 1
As there is no existing 1A to Kirby Hill suspect its the usual VOSA typo and this has sparked twitters to tweet. Stealing passengers? Is that not what the x1 does? I really hope for passengers sake this isn't a hyped up 57 replacement with a detour round Aspin estate for good measure. Edit - double post |
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Post by stevieinselby on Sept 9, 2015 22:36:56 GMT 1
Straight off @harrogatebus Twitter @harrogatebus: Listen up #Boroughbridge! We're the 1 to watch #harrogate #comingsoon #keepwatching @boroughbridge_ @moreharrogate t.co/a34Zpb2U4SOK, looks like I stand corrected – somehow I missed that twit yesterday. It will be interesting to compare it with the 57, which at the moment runs 5 journeys in one direction and 4 in the other. Will it follow the same circuitous route that the 57 does now?  You could probably shave 15 minutes off by running direct from Ferrensby to Knaresborough, which would make it more attractive to the passengers living along the route, but assuming that NYCC won't continue to fund a bus to Boroughbridge alongside a commercial service, that would leave the other villages without a service. Roecliffe likewise could be left out, if the 1A is registered to Kirby Hill. And what a shame that it couldn't have been the 1B that went to Boroughbridge, reinforcing the 1Aspin, 1Boroughbridge and 1Carmires logic... |
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Post by stevieinselby on Sept 9, 2015 22:40:11 GMT 1
I really hope for passengers sake this isn't a hyped up 57 replacement with a detour round Aspin estate for good measure. It wouldn't surprise me if Transdev pulled the service from Aspin, given that they are competing with Connexions on that section and I can't see there being enough passengers from that estate to justify 6bph across two operators – maybe they have decided to do something different with those buses. Although the current 57 route to Boroughbridge isn't far off Aspin so it wouldn't add much to run that way if they are looking to replicate the 57 route. But "for passengers' sake" ... what about the passengers who live in those villages off the main road who are likely to lose out altogether if this service runs straight down A6055? It's not a route I've used so I don't know what the ridership is like and whether those villages do actually contribute a meaningful number of passengers to the service or not... |
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jc
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Post by jc on Sept 10, 2015 0:40:01 GMT 1
I really hope for passengers sake this isn't a hyped up 57 replacement with a detour round Aspin estate for good measure. It wouldn't surprise me if Transdev pulled the service from Aspin, given that they are competing with Connexions on that section and I can't see there being enough passengers from that estate to justify 6bph across two operators – maybe they have decided to do something different with those buses. Although the current 57 route to Boroughbridge isn't far off Aspin so it wouldn't add much to run that way if they are looking to replicate the 57 route. But "for passengers' sake" ... what about the passengers who live in those villages off the main road who are likely to lose out altogether if this service runs straight down A6055? It's not a route I've used so I don't know what the ridership is like and whether those villages do actually contribute a meaningful number of passengers to the service or not... I'm not sure, but for anyone travelling between Boroughbridge and Knaresborough/Harrogate it is very circuitous and seems to show the disconnect between a subsidised service optimised to serve as many houses as possible en route without an alternative, and a commercial service which needs to strike a balance between serving villages en route an being fast and frequent enough to attract new passengers. With the 3 buses that were used on the 56/57/58 of old, a starting point could be running the existing 56 every 2 hours interworking at Harrogate with a 57 running every 2 hours with fewer detours, i.e running direct via Wetherby Road, Arkendale and Minskip, Morrisons and Boroughbridge market place - then continuing on to Roecliffe and/or Staveley to maintain those links. Any severed links would have to be covered by dial-a-ride or alternative tendered services as present. If patronage then started to build as a result of the improved links, then initially an additional peak time bus could be used to improve the frequency while maintaining the clockface pattern (by connecting buses at Knaresborough). |
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Post by SCH117X on Sept 10, 2015 18:11:49 GMT 1
At a guess the 1A will run both ways through Aspin like the x1 and presumably they somehow think linking B'brdge with St James Retail Park will generate custom, or may be more distant with through ticketing with the 142/143. An alternative way is the old 55 route via Marton cum Grafton to B'brdge.
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Post by SCH117X on Sept 12, 2015 9:02:44 GMT 1
Further thought if it did indeed run east from K'boro and then north through Whixley to B'bge then could they be looking at connecting with the 142/143 to offer a H'gate-York alternative to Connexions via Wetherby.
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Post by SCH117X on Sept 23, 2015 18:03:20 GMT 1
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