kendall17
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Justice for the 96!
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Post by kendall17 on Dec 14, 2008 12:41:16 GMT 1
When the service was operated by Black Prince, it used to terminate at Hall Ings. Also the diversion of the service in East Leeds after the take over. I don't think the stretch to Halton Moor would of been as popular as the route Black Prince had it to Colton which provided a useful link with St James Hospital. The 88 did provide a good link with St. James' Hospital but honestly, people preferred to get on the 40 and go up to Seacroft on it & go onto the 50/A. I dont know how the 78 is doing around the Crossgates area but the 88 usually filled the lower deck seats on the Scanias between Colton & Crossgates then it rarely got used as it followed the 40 route. The change in terminus to Halton Moor has proven pretty good, i see it fairly full on a morning when running towards St. James' hospital & Leeds.
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Post by www.buseireann.ie on Dec 14, 2008 15:38:49 GMT 1
Here is an indication that the 63a is to be withdrawn. On the timetable at certian bus stops it is advertised as running only until 23rd December. Some specific sunday journeys will run only until jan 4th. A bit strange for Metro to be doing this, but at least it's a step in the right direction.
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Post by Craig on Dec 14, 2008 18:05:53 GMT 1
I'm confused... is this in relation to the pointless early morning 63A runs, or the Sunday service which only runs to East End Park for the Winter anyway? Or is it just Christmas variations to the service, given the dates quoted?
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mjn
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Post by mjn on Dec 14, 2008 22:07:45 GMT 1
Curiously the 63A seems to have continued to operate on Sundays into winter this year, rather than be replaced by 63s to Ivy Street. I saw them running in late November last time I was up and the timetable makes no mention of a stopping date. Indeed, I caught one but the driver seemed confused, showing 63 Halton Dial and following this route! I think he checked with control once there and they put him straight...
The 73 does indeed terminate at Chapeltown and the 4 at Waterloo, but the 4 runs along Chapeltown and provides a far more frequent and direct service to Leeds than the 73. Therefore, the withdrawal of the 73 would not potentially sever Chapeltown's links to Leeds as I believe Jack suggested, since the 4 is the main service providing such a link.
Incidentally, Black Prince did used to run the 88 to the Interchange some years ago but stopped this before it closed for the rebuilding in 2002(?). It also used to run via Leeds City Bus Station towards Bradford but I believe this stopped around the same time. Several route changes in Gipton also took place (this was my Grandad's nearest service).
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Post by jackh on Dec 15, 2008 17:44:40 GMT 1
The 73 does indeed terminate at Chapeltown and the 4 at Waterloo, but the 4 runs along Chapeltown and provides a far more frequent and direct service to Leeds than the 73. Therefore, the withdrawal of the 73 would not potentially sever Chapeltown's links to Leeds as I believe Jack suggested, since the 4 is the main service providing such a link. If you look at the Leeds travel map and focus in on Pudsey. www.wymetro.com/NR/rdonlyres/9CF6E371-0C53-4B3C-89CD-D2CC4A02A665/0/LeedsRouteMap.pdfThe 73 or the 4 really don't share any common stretches of route in Pudsey. Passengers would have to walk from the Chapeltown/Station Street terminus to Uppermoor or Church Lane to catch the 4 into Leeds.
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Post by andyk4050 on Dec 15, 2008 19:50:20 GMT 1
The 40 servivice is extending to pudsey station street via the present 73 route and they are introducing a new 40A service to operate via the same route from seacroft to stanningley fire station then turn left onto swinnow lane, right onto swinnow road, straight on through pudsey to pudsey cenataph and turn round via the present 91 route at station street and vice versa
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Post by jackh on Dec 15, 2008 20:27:26 GMT 1
That is interesting to know. I guess the new buses that the 16 is to recieve which Ross told us about will be in service by then. Where would the low floor buses come from otherwise?
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Post by Craig on Dec 15, 2008 20:52:01 GMT 1
To help clear up this 4/73 confusion, the 4 does run along Chapeltown (which remember is only a short stretch of road anyway) on its way to Waterloo. The 73 also uses Chapeltown as part of its loop, as this runs up Carlisle Road to Chapeltown then back via Greenside. The real issue would therefore not have related to the service levels to Chapeltown, but how passengers in Fulneck/Littlemoor would be affected by the change. However, judging by the above post it looks like a 20-min frequency service 40 will be introduced (as I predicted!), therefore nothing is lost!
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Post by www.buseireann.ie on Dec 16, 2008 13:43:16 GMT 1
In the past, one of the local councillors representing East End Park/Cross Green residents kicked up a fuss about the level of service throughout the week to this notorious crime riddled area. I lived up there for 25 years and thank god I was able to flee the nest and move elsewhere because you needed a bus to ensure you wern't at risk of being mugged. Drivers will tell you that this scruffy bolthole has endured more than it's fair share of vandalisim, burnt out cars, muggings, burglaries etc. Even though it's close to town (within reasonable walking distance), the local councillors decided to contribute towards funding for any service serving this area should the need arrise for funding, and I do believe this arrangement still exists. What I don't understand however is the need for the 63a to run 10 mins in front of the 63 on a morning, and for there to be far more buses on a Sunday than the rest of the week. This is something what Metro, and local councillors should look at. What a total waste of money!
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kendall17
Forum Member
Justice for the 96!
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Post by kendall17 on Dec 16, 2008 13:57:25 GMT 1
In the past, one of the local councillors representing East End Park/Cross Green residents kicked up a fuss about the level of service throughout the week to this notorious crime riddled area. I lived up there for 25 years and thank god I was able to flee the nest and move elsewhere because you needed a bus to ensure you wern't at risk of being mugged. Drivers will tell you that this scruffy bolthole has endured more than it's fair share of vandalisim, burnt out cars, muggings, burglaries etc. Even though it's close to town (within reasonable walking distance), the local councillors decided to contribute towards funding for any service serving this area should the need arrise for funding, and I do believe this arrangement still exists. What I don't understand however is the need for the 63a to run 10 mins in front of the 63 on a morning, and for there to be far more buses on a Sunday than the rest of the week. This is something what Metro, and local councillors should look at. What a total waste of money! Thats very harsh on E.E.P & Cross Green! i know its very opinionated but it isn't that bad. Everywhere has areas like that and crimes like that occur in other places of the city and dont just circulate around 1 area!
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Post by nick on Dec 16, 2008 16:55:54 GMT 1
How do we know that this 40/40A service will become true. Am sorry but VOSA haven't published this yet so until you here it come from the horses mouth, this is not true. Although at the moment it seems like the realistic version.
VOSA need to SORT OUT, OUT OF DATE SERVICE NUMBERS AND ROUTES-Since when did the 97/97A operate to Bradford. ABOUT time this so called "we are chief of public transport" (i know i don't really know what it stands for but i do know that they are in charge of Public Transport) sorted out all of its registrations some are 2-3 years out of date.
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Post by hanovers on Dec 16, 2008 18:21:37 GMT 1
How do we know that this 40/40A service will become true. Am sorry but VOSA haven't published this yet so until you here it come from the horses mouth, this is not true. Although at the moment it seems like the realistic version. The info about new service 40/40A was published in the last edition of "First to Hear", the weekly First Leeds staff newsletter. That good enough for you?
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Post by Craig on Dec 16, 2008 20:33:35 GMT 1
Did said newsletter include details of the rest of the forthcoming changes?
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Post by rossbailey on Dec 16, 2008 23:08:09 GMT 1
Well if the new extended 40/40A services run at off-peak on an split hourly basis I guess we may just see the end of the off-peak 44 journeys between Bramley and Pudsey at last and was rumoured a couple of months ago.
This would then allow for the 44A to be introduced at off-peak to replace the 16A’s between Bramley – Rodley and allow all the 16's to run via one single route via Coal Hill - Intake Lane and Leeds/Bradford road.
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Post by hanovers on Dec 16, 2008 23:14:44 GMT 1
Did said newsletter include details of the rest of the forthcoming changes? No, it said more to come in the next edition, which will be 23rd December. There isn't one this week. From what I've heard there are to be some major changes, with routes being merged with others, and other routes being diverted. I believe the main point is to take buses of little used routes, and put more buses onto the Overground routes. I've heard that the 16 and 49 are to have en extra bus allocated to them, to give more running time, and improve reliability.
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Post by jackh on Dec 16, 2008 23:22:01 GMT 1
VOSA need to SORT OUT, OUT OF DATE SERVICE NUMBERS AND ROUTES-Since when did the 97/97A operate to Bradford. ABOUT time this so called "we are chief of public transport" (i know i don't really know what it stands for but i do know that they are in charge of Public Transport) sorted out all of its registrations some are 2-3 years out of date. It is the operators who submit these registration forms to VOSA which appear to be out of date. From time to time, operators tidy up their records by cancelling a long list of services on a particular registration where only one service out of them actually still operates. They then re register the service that still exists as a new record. I hope this clears things up Nick.
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Post by jackh on Dec 16, 2008 23:34:39 GMT 1
The info about new service 40/40A was published in the last edition of "First to Hear", the weekly First Leeds staff newsletter. That good enough for you? I never knew First had a staff newsletter in circulation aptly named "First to Hear"! Thanks for posting on the forum and keep us informed of anything of interest!
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Post by jackh on Dec 17, 2008 0:16:14 GMT 1
Just trying to fit the jugsaw pieces together here! So Ross, you say the daytime journeys on the 44/44A are to be cut back so the service will only operate evening and Sundays only as the 44A between Bramley and Pudsey.
So Armley Ridge Road would be left without a service, can't see what service would be diverted that way.
Raynville Road could possibly be covered by a re-routed 91/91A as the VOSA registration suggests.
Bagley Lane could well end up with no daytime service either.
Swinnow Lane would be covered by the new 40A service.
Correct me if I'm wrong please.
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Post by dwarfer1979 on Dec 17, 2008 8:51:01 GMT 1
VOSA need to SORT OUT, OUT OF DATE SERVICE NUMBERS AND ROUTES-Since when did the 97/97A operate to Bradford. ABOUT time this so called "we are chief of public transport" (i know i don't really know what it stands for but i do know that they are in charge of Public Transport) sorted out all of its registrations some are 2-3 years out of date. It is the operators who submit these registration forms to VOSA which appear to be out of date. From time to time, operators tidy up their records by cancelling a long list of services on a particular registration where only one service out of them actually still operates. They then re register the service that still exists as a new record. I hope this clears things up Nick. Operators change the details on the registrations they send, VOSA don't update the information they list it under. The forms sent by the operators don't carry start and finish points for changes, just license number and route number, and even then VOSA don't update the route numbers when registrations are changed. It shouldn't be the operators responsibility to tidy up VOSA records, especially when it would cost £57 per registration to do what you outline (it is free to cancel but £57 to register or alter).
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Post by rossbailey on Dec 17, 2008 14:28:01 GMT 1
No that’s not what I meant.
What I meant to say was that the Daytime 44/44A would run from Leeds to Pudsey via its Normal routes and Timetable. But on an Evening and Sunday they would run from Leeds to Bramley centre as now via Rayville’s but instead of going to Pudsey via Broad lane and Swinnow the service would operate to Farsley Civic Hall via the Daytime 44A & Off peak 16A's service. Operating from Bramley Town Street down Whitcote Hill into Rodley then onto Bagley Lane and up to Farsley.
This then allows for the Evenings and Sunday 16A’s to be discontinued and allow the service 16’s run half hourly from Bramley to Pudsey via Leeds/Bradford Road, Intake Lane, Coal Hill Lane onto Bagley lane and through Farsley.
The Section of Broad-lane which the 44 currently operates on at off-peak would be covered by the 91's and new half hourly service 16's on Leeds Bradford Road. Meanwhile the Stanningley to Pudsey section would now be covered by the new service 40/40A and Bramley to Leeds via Raynvilles would be still covered with a service 44A.
Hope that makes better sense.
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Post by jackh on Dec 17, 2008 17:53:59 GMT 1
Operators change the details on the registrations they send, VOSA don't update the information they list it under. The forms sent by the operators don't carry start and finish points for changes, just license number and route number, and even then VOSA don't update the route numbers when registrations are changed. It shouldn't be the operators responsibility to tidy up VOSA records, especially when it would cost £57 per registration to do what you outline (it is free to cancel but £57 to register or alter). I never knew that VOSA imposed charges to operators for amending and registering a service. But why should it be free to cancel one.
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Post by Craig on Dec 17, 2008 19:42:57 GMT 1
I always thought that VOSA charged for cancelling registrations as well as registering/amending!
It makes sense to me to cut the 44 altogether in lieu of new service 40A, although this does sever a link between Bramley and Swinnow. All 44 buses would be best running on the 44A route to Rodley, and on to Farsley/Owlcotes if absolutely necessary.
Just a thought, I wonder if the 91's route change is possibly for it to call at St. James' Hospital, in order to maintain the link to Halton Moor which appears to be lost with the 88 cut? Also I can't see any obvious way that the Pudsey to Bradford portion of the 88 will be kept, so it does look like it will just be the 711. For a large town and a city so close, it seems odd that there wouldn't be more demand for this link.
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kendall17
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Justice for the 96!
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Post by kendall17 on Dec 17, 2008 20:57:17 GMT 1
How will the 91 call @ st. James' hopsital? it isn't the greatest idea and unless it becomes circular (compton - st james' - compton) then there is no way around it due to one way & no left right turns.
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Post by Craig on Dec 17, 2008 21:22:39 GMT 1
It's just a possible suggestion, I guess it could divert via Ashley Road/Compton Road.
I was thinking it could use Harehills Road but I had forgotten about the left/right turn restrictions at Fforde Grene.
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kendall17
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Justice for the 96!
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Post by kendall17 on Dec 17, 2008 21:32:32 GMT 1
when you come to the Fforde Greene junction from the 12/13/49/50 route you can only go straight on towards Empire Electrics - which is Beckett Street onto Roundhay Road to go back onto Harehills Lane Best bet would be -Harehills Ln - (turn right onto) Compton Rd - Stoney Rock Ln - Nippett Ln (Anglers' Club) - Becketts Street - Ashley Rd - Harehills Ln. Even that seems too long winded for the likes of First Leeds. Some short working circular will be introduced. Halton Moor - St James' - Eastgate - Mabgate (area) - St' James' - Halton Moor
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