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Post by stevieinselby on Aug 4, 2013 20:08:35 GMT 1
I wonder whether Transdev are dumping York local work so that they can bid for East Yorkshire without creating OFT concern in York? In other news, they are replacing their B10BLEs with pink unicorns... Transdev have lost contracts totalling PVR7, and have now re-registered PVR2 * of those commercially. That suggests that there was probably nothing strategic like that in relinquishing the contracts. Although with the school contracts going as well, they are going to have a lot of spare depot and driver capacity in Fulford, which makes me wonder if they are planning a full-frontal assault on commercial services in and around York. The OFT couldn't give a wet slap about Transdev having a monopoly, and even if they did, that handful of routes wouldn't make a blind bit of difference. The overlap between the two networks is minimal – they meet in York and Scarborough, but only at the very fringes of their networks. EYMS still have extensive competition from Stagecoach across their core network area, and fringe competition from First York in and around York. Even without losing these contracts, Transdev and EYMS combined would have only about 20% of services within York. It would be far less of a concern to the OFT than many of their existing operations elsewhere! * I'm assuming it will be the same sort of timetable but I haven't seen the detail, it could conceivably be PVR1.
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SF07
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Post by SF07 on Aug 5, 2013 20:20:03 GMT 1
Going through the district bus service changes PDFs on the Metro website, the following service should undergo changes on 31 August/1 September (no mention of M Travel's services in Leeds): *Revised Route: 229, H1, H6 *Revised Timetables: 24 (Tates), 55, 63, 72, 90, 96/96A (Tates), 209, 220, 222, 223, 255 (0558 Cleckheaton-Halifax, 0640 Halifax-Leeds re-timed), 268 (Weekday evening peak journeys re-timed), 443 (0707 from Wakefield re-timed to run at 0705, 1840 journey from Hall Green re-timed to run at 1845), 505, 629, 760, 916, H5, X844 *Revised Route and Timetables: 66/67 (Transdev), 202/203, 321, 324, 335 (JRT), 343, 387, 935, 936, 937, 938, 939, FTB *Cancelled: 288 (SGI), 305 (Bassi Travel), 370A (Bassi Travel), 392 (HJC), X99 (Geldards) *New services: 373 (operated by First between Huddersfield Westgate and New College every 30 mins between 0900 and 1530 when college is open)*Others: 281/282/283 (To amend 3 timing points)www.wymetro.com/uploadedFiles/WYMetro/Content/travelnews/operators/3%20Wkly%20KLS%2018.04.13%20-%2023.05.13.pdfwww.wymetro.com/uploadedFiles/WYMetro/Content/travelnews/operators/3%20Wkly%20LDS%2018.04.13%20-%2023.05.13.pdfwww.wymetro.com/uploadedFiles/WYMetro/Content/travelnews/operators/3%20Weekly%20CLD%2018.04.13%20-%2023.05.13.pdfwww.wymetro.com/uploadedFiles/WYMetro/Content/travelnews/operators/3%20Weekly%20BFD%2018.04.13%20-%2023.05.13.pdfwww.wymetro.com/uploadedFiles/WYMetro/Content/travelnews/operators/3%20Wkly%20WKD%2018.04.13%20-%2023.05.13.pdf
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Post by angrycommuter on Aug 6, 2013 11:24:00 GMT 1
The 373 is interesting as it looks like students will now have to get a service bus to hudds and the connect to get to new college.
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Danny
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Post by Danny on Aug 6, 2013 22:27:02 GMT 1
First have registered NC1, NC2, NC3 & NC6. NC2 now starts at Illingworth.
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SF07
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Posts: 3,216
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Post by SF07 on Aug 7, 2013 18:58:24 GMT 1
Changing Times booklet on the Metro website. Changes are: *25 (Transdev) - The 1538 journey from Cross Hills to Keighley (operated by Keighley & District) will be replaced by 66A. All Transdev Burnley & Pendle journeys unchanged *55 (First) - Sunday times changed. City centre terminus will now be Vicar Lane with passengers able to travel from Infirmary Street to Morley on Mondays-Saturdays only *63 (Centrebus) - Times changed with service operating hourly weekdays between 0930 and 1500. Saturday timetable remains half-hourly but operates 5 mins earlier *64 (First) - Times changed during afternoon peak journeys and Sundays. Journeys into Leeds will operate via Ivy Street flyover. *66A (Transdev) - New weekday journey introduced at 1538 from Cross Hills to Keighley, replacing same journey as service 25. *67 (Transdev) - 1520 journey from Cross Hill will terminate at Cononley instead of Skipton *72 (First) - Times changed to improve reliability *90 (First) - The 1827 Sunday journey from Leeds will be re-timed to run 10 mins later *96A (Tates) - The 1450 weekday journey from Barnsley to Kexborough will only operate on school holidays *110 (Arriva) - Times changed to improve reliability. Arriva have also started running a late journey from Leeds Arena to Wakefield, running at 2315 on weekdays when an event is on and finishes at 2300 *150 (Arriva) - From 16 September: The 1205 and 1305 Mon-Sat journeys from Selby will be re-timed to leave 10 mins earlier and re-routed via Hensall. The 0845 Mon-Sat and 1645 Sat journey from Wakefield are re-routed via Hensall and re-timed to arrive in Selby 10 mins later. *202/203 (Arriva) - Times changed to improve reliability. The 1650 weekday 202 journey from Huddersfield will continue from Dewsbury to Leeds, while the 1705 weekday 203 journey from Huddersfield will terminate at Shaw Cross instead of Leeds. *209 (Arriva) - Times changed with minor changes between Leeds and Wortley Ringways. *220/222 (Arriva) - Timing point in Bruntcliffe moved to High School instead of Crossroads. 222 timing point at Gomersal to Heckmondwike is moved to Cricket Ground instead of Hill Top. *223 (Arriva) - The 0712 weekday journey from Leeds to Mirfield is re-timed between Batley and Heckmondwike to improve reliability. *255 (Arriva) The 0558 weekday journey from Cleckheaton to Halifax and 0640 weekday journey from Halifax to Leeds are re-timed to run 5 mins earlier *256/283 (Arriva) - Timing point in East Bierley moved to Southway (beside Golf Club) instead of The Green *268 (Arriva) - Weekday afternoon journeys from Dewsbury re-timed to improve reliability. The 1855 journey from Bradford re-timed to run 5 mins later. *281/282/283 (Arriva) - Timing point change at Thornhill Lees to Brewery Lane Medical Centre instead of Post Office, while timing point at Howden Clough moved to Windsor Road/Arundel Close instead of the school *288 (SGI) - Withdrawn *321/324 (First) - Route and times changed with services re-routed to Meltham via Mean Lane instead of Slaithwaite Road. *335 (JRT) - The 1813 and 1840 weekday journeys from Slaithwaite are re-timed to run 1 minute later. *342 (First) - Times changed to improve reliablity *343 (K-Line) - Service re-routed in Elland to serve Morrisons supermarket. *356 (First) - Times changed to improve reliablity *358 (First) - Times changed to improve reliablity *373 (First) - New collegeday service between Huddersfield Westgate and New College via Trinity St, Westbourne Road and New Hey Road, running hourly between 0900 and 1600. *387 (First) - Route and times changed due to access problems. The service will now operate from Huddersfield Bus Station via Market Street, High Street, Ramsden Street, Peel Street, Princess Street, Alfred Street, Queensgate, Manchester Road, Blackmoorfoot Road, Park Road, Yew Green Road, Moor End Road, Walpole Road, Dryclough Road, Beaumont Park Road then Moor End, Road, Yew Green Road, Park Road, Blackmoorfoot Road, Manchester Road, Outcote Bank, Castlegate and High Street Huddersfield - Market Street. Chapel Hill, Lockwood Road, Victoria Road, North Street and Yews Hill Road will no longer be served. *392 (HJC) - Withdrawn *443 (Arriva) - The 0707 weekday journey from Wakefield re-timed to run 5 mins earlier. The 1840 journey from Hall Green re-timed to run 5 mins later *505 (First) - The 1330 journey from Halifax is re-timed to run 1 hour earlier on Mondays. *629 (TLC) - Times changed with 1527 and 1627 journeys from Shipley terminating at Smiddles Lane instead of Morrisons. The 1615 and 1715 journeys from Morrisons will now start at Smiddles Lane at 1622 and 1722 *760 (Transdev) - Times changed to improve reliabliity *916 (TLC) - The 1440 weekday journey from Keighley will operate via Oakworth Manor Drive at 1501 instead of 1528 *937 (JRT) - Times changed with some journeys withdrawn and introduced. *938 (JRT) - Times changed with some journeys withdrawn and introduced. *939 (JRT) - Times changed with some journeys withdrawn. *FTB (K-Line) - Huddersfield FreeTownBus re-routed, no longer serving Market Place, Cloth Hall Street or Market Street. Re-routed to serve Kirklees College and Waterfront on collegedays only. *H5 (Stotts) - New journeys at 0838 and 1638 from Netherthong to Holmfirth and 1653 from Holmfirth to Holmbridge *X64 (M Travel) - New Mon-Sat daytime service between Kippax and Leeds via Garforth and A1(M). *X84 (First) - Weekday afternoon journeys re-timed. www.wymetro.com/uploadedFiles/WYMetro/Content/travelnews/ServiceChanges/Timetables_for_service_changes_page_(will_be_deleted_each_time)/PTC_AugSept_infoleaflet.pdf
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Post by FIYHANunDer on Aug 7, 2013 19:14:27 GMT 1
The 64 seems an odd one, with it operating over the Ivy Street flyover it will miss two bus stops, any ideas why? Seems strange just to miss these two stops to enable timings to be met. And if it isn't serving certain stops on route will the route have to be re-registered as a "Limited Stop" service? Any thoughts?
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Post by stevieinselby on Aug 8, 2013 0:27:16 GMT 1
The 64 seems an odd one, with it operating over the Ivy Street flyover it will miss two bus stops, any ideas why? Seems strange just to miss these two stops to enable timings to be met. And if it isn't serving certain stops on route will the route have to be re-registered as a "Limited Stop" service? Any thoughts? The 64/64A timetable looks to be quite tight, buses only need to be held up for a few minutes and they will be late starting the next journey, and so it goes on. If buses are struggling to keep to time and that junction has been identified as an area where they could save a couple of minutes then it seems like a sensible thing to do. Given that those two stops are already served by frequent buses on other routes, it won't cause any great hardship to lose 2bph from the 64/64A.
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Post by FIYHANunDer on Aug 8, 2013 9:16:46 GMT 1
The 64 seems an odd one, with it operating over the Ivy Street flyover it will miss two bus stops, any ideas why? Seems strange just to miss these two stops to enable timings to be met. And if it isn't serving certain stops on route will the route have to be re-registered as a "Limited Stop" service? Any thoughts? The 64/64A timetable looks to be quite tight, buses only need to be held up for a few minutes and they will be late starting the next journey, and so it goes on. If buses are struggling to keep to time and that junction has been identified as an area where they could save a couple of minutes then it seems like a sensible thing to do. Given that those two stops are already served by frequent buses on other routes, it won't cause any great hardship to lose 2bph from the 64/64A. And that is fine although if the timetable is that tight that they need to miss a couple of stops on one way only then the timetable needs looking at, I don't think it will even save them a couple of minutes to be honest,I regularly travel to Leeds from Cross Gates using the 56, 64 or 40 and they never seem to be held up for any reasonable time at the Ivy Street stops. How much standing time does the service get at each end, couldn't this be used to add extra time somewhere in the journey? And, I know customer service is never on First's priority list, what happens if you have pax who can only use the 64 and want to alight at Ivy Street? What do they do, change services at Cross Gates? Just doesn't seem fair, all in the name of shaving 40 seconds off the journey time into Leeds.
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Post by Craig on Aug 8, 2013 22:05:05 GMT 1
York Road services from the City Centre all already use the flyover as there is a stop at the end of it. Going the other way if the 64 is going along the flyover there is no need for it to be "limited stop". It still will observe all stops en route, it just so happens there isn't any stops on the flyover city-bound! Looks like it is shaving a minute off the journey time, increasing the layover at Aberford to 7 minutes. At the other end though there is a lot of padding at Gildersome. The timings are as such to fit neatly in with the 55 and 74 between City and Holbeck.
Note that Sunday running times are also increased and the 64/90 interworking will now also include a cycle on the 55. The 55 and 74A will leave City for Holbeck at opposite half hours (xx07 and xx37 mins - great). But the disbenefit here is that from Holbeck to City they will run 1 minute apart (xx07 and xx08 - not so great).
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Post by FIYHANunDer on Aug 8, 2013 22:12:15 GMT 1
If the service is scheduled to get 7 mins standing time then why just not change that to 4 and carry on with a normal stopping service that doesn't need to omit stops to keep to time. I tend to use the 64 from Cross Gates to Leeds as it never seems as busy or take as long as other services (the 56 stops at every stop religiously) so it will be even quicker. It just seems an odd thing to do.
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Post by www.buseireann.ie on Aug 9, 2013 13:23:39 GMT 1
Sorry Craig but city bound it does look to be missing 1 stop at the begining of the flyover as I'm sure if the lane for the flyover starts before it can reach that stop. The stop after the flyover could end up being missed as well I think, is it too near the end of the flyover for a bus to cross over to it safely?
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Post by jabbott1987 on Aug 9, 2013 15:43:29 GMT 1
There are 2 bus stop that can't be served when buses goes over the Fly-Over these been - York Road East End Park Dawlish Aveune (45010830) (Which is situated on the off Slip Road) & York Road East End Park Raincliffe Road (45010832) (Which is situated at the end of the On slip road & can't be served due to there been traffic lights).
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Post by northrob on Aug 9, 2013 18:31:06 GMT 1
Squeezing in at the end of September are the service changes brought about by First as a result of the public consultation that they had recently: www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/york/travel_news/news_initiatives/?item=12421&conf=0First has listened to York bus customers and is planning a number of network improvements to meet their needs. From Sunday 29 September, First's bus network in York will see changes that are based on feedback from customers who took part in First's major consultation exercise this summer. First is promising this is the start of a series of positive changes over the next few weeks. A mini 'transport hub' in Acomb, better services to the University of York and the return of a half hourly service in Haxby are the headlines and many other bus customers in York will see positive changes as a result of their feedback. The changes include: Acomb - Services 4 and 5 will run into Acomb forming a mini transport hub and re-establishing links to Acomb Front Street. Haxby - Services 13 and 13A - First has introduced a new Service 13A to create additional journeys between Haxby and York with four arrivals in the centre by 9am. University of York (Heslington) - Services 4 and 6 will now run to the University and will serve the Heslington East campus, creating a direct link from the University to Tang Hall and the hospital. Extra morning buses to York Railway Station (Station Avenue) - Service 2 will run three extra early morning buses from Clifton Moor, via Rawcliffe Bar, to York Railway Station. Eight consultation meetings were held across York so people could give their views on current bus services. They could also comment by filling in an online survey or by writing to First. More than six hundred people gave their views on what they would like to see from their local York bus operator. First has gone through all the feedback from customers and has looked to use this as the base for improvements to the network in York. First believes that by listening to the demands of customers the city of York will see passenger growth on buses. Simon Pearson, Commercial Director for First in York, said: "This is the beginning of a new and exciting journey for First in York. "We have enjoyed listening to the views of hundreds of our customers and we have used their feedback to make a number of initial network improvements that show we are committed to change. "Our aim is to grow the number of people using First buses in York and we believe that by listening to what our customers and the wider York communities say then we are in a stronger position to achieve this in the future. "We plan to make further positive announcements in the next few weeks which I believe will change the perception of many people towards bus travel in the city." Cllr Dave Merrett, City of York Council Cabinet Member for Transport, Planning and Sustainability, said: "This is great news for York bus users and we're delighted that First has taken these steps, has listened to customers' views and are now making these significant changes. "The council is committed to working with all bus companies and all bus users in York to try and ensure we can deliver a better more comprehensive network, with good frequencies, service coverage and usage. The council recently announced that a number of city wide bus network improvements were being made throughout August and September, funded by the government, which will complement First's improvements to provide an even better bus service for residents and visitors." This is a full list of service changes Service 1 Wigginton-Chapelfields via City Centre At this stage we are undertaking a small number of changes to this service to address reliability and the evening service provided. On Monday to Friday journeys from Wigginton between 0755 and 0815 are retimed to depart up to 5 minutes earlier to improve reliability. On evenings the frequency is amended to operate every 30 minutes. Service 2 Clifton Moor/Rawcliffe Bar-City Centre The first three journeys from Rawcliffe Bar on Monday to Friday now start from Clifton Moor (Oakdale Road/Gouthwaite Close). Service 4 University-Acomb via City Centre This service will now operate between Acomb, York City Centre and the University of York Heslington East campus operating at frequent intervals (a bus at least every 10 minutes) Monday to Saturday daytime, a 15 minute frequency Sunday daytime and a 30 minute frequency on evenings. Services 5 and 5A Strensall-Foxwood via City Centre These services operate between Acomb, York and Strensall. Service 5 continues to operate via Danebury Drive every 30 minutes Monday to Saturday daytime and new Service 5A operates every 30 minutes during Monday to Saturday daytime via Beckfield Lane and Ridgeway. On Sunday daytime each service operates every hour combining to a 30 minute service over the common sections of route. On Evenings service 5 operates hourly from Strensall towards Acomb, returning as service 5A every hour back to Strensall - passengers for Ridgeway and Beckfield Lane, and from Danebury Drive can travel through on journeys across Acomb - this is also possible during the daytime when each service operates every 30 minutes (Monday to Saturday) and hourly (Sunday). Tudor Road is now served by service 13A for journeys towards Acomb and service 4 for journeys from Acomb. Service 6 Clifton Moor-University via City Centre This service now extends during the daytime to The University of York Heslington East campus - journeys from Clifton Moor operating via Tranby Avenue, those returning to Clifton Moor operating via Osbaldwick Link Road. Evening service continue to start and finish in Osbaldwick village. Three early morning journeys on service 2 now start from Clifton Moor (Oakdale Road/Gouthwaite Close) providing alternative ways to get to York City Centre at this time. Service 9 Monks Cross Park and Ride-City Centre An additional journey is provided Monday to Friday at 2010 from Monks Cross Aviva - omitting the park and ride site to York City Centre. Services 10 and 10A Stamford Bridge-Poppleton via City Centre The Monday to Friday timetable is amended to provide earlier journeys into York and improve reliability. On a Sunday the timetable is thoroughly revised to improve to reliability of the service. Services 13 Haxby-Copmanthorpe and 13A Haxby-Acomb Service 13 has an unchanged route and frequency, but the timetable is amended to improve reliability. Additional journeys between Haxby and York will be provided by new service 13A which will extend to Acomb via the present service 16 route and Tudor Road on outward journeys this gives two buses per hour Monday to Saturday daytime between Haxby and York, and vice-versa. Service 14 York Sport Village-Acomb This service is withdrawn, Hull Road continues to be served by services 8, 10 and 10A, Boroughbridge Road by services 10, 10A, Beckfield Lane and Ridgeway are served by new service 5A. Service 16 This service is withdrawn and replaced by new service 13a operating every hour.
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Post by glennh2 on Aug 9, 2013 21:39:02 GMT 1
Metro tweeted short notice operator changes today. 492 and 493 revert to Arriva. 780 and 923 change to Harrogate Coach Travel, all as from Monday. Hope it's not the end of Sandla Transport
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jc
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Posts: 431
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Post by jc on Aug 11, 2013 13:16:35 GMT 1
The First York changes seem to be a change of about PVR 0 - after 2 attempts Beckfield Lane & Danebury Drive (which lost the 1 every 10 minutes) has dropped to every 30. The morning 2 extension from Clifton Moor is good for trying to encourage more car commuters at marginal cost, but there's no scope for expansion using existing buses without reducing services to Clifton Park (Shipton Road) and hitting the car park that is the A1237 at peak hours. They could start them from Clarence Street though, and pick up some shift workers from the hospital perhaps and commuters to Clifton Moor (an X6 of sorts).
I wonder if HCT might look into running buses from Wetherby to York via Tadcaster once the NYCC cuts kick in via Tockwith.
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Post by SCH117X on Aug 11, 2013 15:09:35 GMT 1
The NYCC proposed cuts do not affect the HCT journeys via Tockwith as they are run commercially.
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Post by rider5521 on Aug 11, 2013 18:21:26 GMT 1
Danebury will still have 4 buses to York per hour, after travelling to Acomb the bus will return as a 5A via Beckfield Lane, the same applies with Beckfield Lane residents as the 5A turns into a 5, through travel is allowed if passengers wish to do this.
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jc
Forum Member
Posts: 431
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Post by jc on Aug 11, 2013 23:05:27 GMT 1
The NYCC proposed cuts do not affect the HCT journeys via Tockwith as they are run commercially. I just figured HCT might want to try running alternate hours via Tadcaster and Tockwith to try the Boston Spa-York market, since they haven't taken on the whole 412/3 commercially. Sorry, had it in mind the 4/5 were still interworking!
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Post by deerfold on Aug 14, 2013 13:40:39 GMT 1
Metro tweeted short notice operator changes today. 492 and 493 revert to Arriva. 780 and 923 change to Harrogate Coach Travel, all as from Monday. Hope it's not the end of Sandla Transport It is. It's also a shame if Metro knew that then but they've still not been able to update the timetable on their website.
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Post by Burnside on Aug 14, 2013 15:28:19 GMT 1
Why would they need to update it so quickly?
All that has changed is the operator - times and route are unchanged and it is times that most people will be looking for.
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SF07
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Post by SF07 on Aug 14, 2013 19:19:41 GMT 1
The Changing Times page on the Metro website does make reference of the change of operator for 492/493, 780 and 923, although the timetable pages for the 780 and 923 are still showing Sandla. The 492/493 looks like the old Arriva timetable from before Sandla took over with the old 491 timetable included. www.wymetro.com/travelnews/ServiceChanges/ServiceChanges/Meanwhile, 534 has been re-routed permanently since last Monday following collapse of Brow Lane in Shibden.
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Post by stevieinselby on Aug 14, 2013 20:04:37 GMT 1
Why would they need to update it so quickly? All that has changed is the operator - times and route are unchanged and it is times that most people will be looking for. As Arrive-with-no-style had an even more random selection of buses than Transdev York, and were quite happily running buses in First and Stagecoach livery with no destination board, it isn't as though passengers are going to be massively thrown by an Arriva, Utopia or Connexionsbuses vehicle turning up! Especially as all of them except the 923 are reverting to their previous operator...
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Post by deerfold on Aug 15, 2013 10:48:23 GMT 1
Why would they need to update it so quickly? All that has changed is the operator - times and route are unchanged and it is times that most people will be looking for. Well, if your bus doesn't turn up and you want to ring the operator it's good to have current contact details there. I understand it's not so easy to change all the bus stops but surely changing one line in a handful of timetables on-line shouldn't take a week.
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Post by Arriva Wakefield on Aug 15, 2013 13:07:05 GMT 1
Why would they need to update it so quickly? All that has changed is the operator - times and route are unchanged and it is times that most people will be looking for. Well, if your bus doesn't turn up and you want to ring the operator it's good to have current contact details there. I understand it's not so easy to change all the bus stops but surely changing one line in a handful of timetables on-line shouldn't take a week. You might find that there is a scheduled upload/update due, and these changes have been kept back until then.
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Post by deerfold on Aug 16, 2013 15:39:13 GMT 1
Well, if your bus doesn't turn up and you want to ring the operator it's good to have current contact details there. I understand it's not so easy to change all the bus stops but surely changing one line in a handful of timetables on-line shouldn't take a week. You might find that there is a scheduled upload/update due, and these changes have been kept back until then. And if that's how they deal with emergency timetable changes they could do with finding a quicker way of dealing with it. However as some timetables have been incorrect since Metro updated their website several months ago I'm not surprised.
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